Where does James Harden rate All Time in shooting guards ?

Probably the most hilarious comment on Clutchfans, ever.

You must be under 18 years old.

 

The problem is that you used it in lieu of stating something legitimate to defend your opinion. I don't blame you, of course you have to reject literally every metric because none of them support your opinion and instead completely destroy it.

I honestly was hoping that you'd come up with something though and that's why I continued as long as I did.

 

Well, when you use stupid stats to determine the better player between eras that are totally different, then you should know that people who actually know what they're talking about disagree with you.

 

Wut?

Not sure if serious?

 

He's dead serious along with the rest of these guys that prefer basketball reference rather than actually watching the game.

 

Who was our 2nd star last year? Also, I would not consider Dwight a star after his first year.

 

Harden is the best combo guard we’ve ever seen

 

You call them "dumb stats" but you don't respond with any stats that show your opinion has some basis in reality. Also, when you use the excuse that the stats show a bias for the current era over previous eras.....well it didn't affect MJ....just Kobe.

Again, when all you have to support your opinion is the opinion of others.....well it's not going to convince a lot of people that all objective metrics are wrong.

 

Been watching games. Kobe was much like Russell Westbrook. People would see the intense scowl on their face and assume that meant they were playing good defense. Neither of them do.

 

I'm 41. Been a Rockets fan since I was 8 years old.

 

I put him at 5, behind MJ, Kobe, Ginobili, and Wade.

Peak TMac was better than him too if we are counting just players in their primes. But of course, TMac had a very short prime.

 

What's interesting is that I can use those "dumb stats" to show that once upon a time Kobe was a very good defender, which is one of the claims....but that defense falls off after he was 25 and he was really nothing terribly special defensively after that point.

I can use those "dumb stats" to show all kinds of things largely believed true....in fact the only thing we can't show is that Kobe was better than Harden. Those "dumb stats" seemingly have it out for Kobe and don't affect anyone else.

 

MJ is on a different level than anyone in the history of sports. There are no stats for defense that are worth a crap, so you can say whatever you want to push your narrative, but that doesn't make you right. Same story with all your qb analysis.

 

So in that case we should listen to what Barkley says since he was a good player and clearly his opinion is more important than others? And those same “dumb metrics” are being used heavily by the Warriors, Rockets and Spurs front office who put together winning teams. Go take a look at the decisions Michael Jordan made as a GM/player evaluator...

 

Ok, then watch more basketball outside of the rockets.

 

You say that, but the defensive metrics, though flawed, generally show that the best defenders are the best defenders....those same "dumb stats" even show that Kobe was a very good defender early in his career. I guess they just start discriminating against him later in his career.

It's kind of telling that you can't come up with a single legitimate thing to defend your perspective on this.

 

In fairness, those teams have better metrics than those that are publicly available....but to suggest that all metrics are worthless simply because they don't show what you want them to when it comes to a single player....yeah that's a bit crazy.

I'll be the first to admit that every metric is flawed, but when you can't find ANY metric to show what you believe to be true....perhaps it's not true.

 

I just looked up Win Shares...Kobe is #15 all time, regardless of position. More than Magic Johnson, Hakeem, Bill Russell, Larry Bird, Clyde Drexler, Dwayne Wade...

Yup, guess he really is the 2nd best SG in NBA History.

Thanks for your referral to Basketball Reference.

I also looked up Defensive Win Shares....Kobe is the 2nd SG on list behind MJ.

Nice.

 

seriously? a decent argument can be made for and against kobe/wade but ginobili???????

That's just stupid.

 

You are just showing that you don't understand what that metric says. It's a compilation stat. Given that he's played the 8th most minutes in NBA history, he really should have a ton of win shares.

Given that he played more than 15,000 minutes more than Magic Johnson, of course he has more win shares, he has over 4000 more minutes than Olajuwon, 8000 more than Bill Russell, 14000 more than Larry Bird, 10000 more than Drexler, 16000 more than Wade.....

I mean, I get why you don't like stats given that you don't seem to understand them.

How about we neutralize that stat by using win shares per 48 minutes played? I wonder what it'll say

Dwayne Wade #53
Clyde Drexler #51
Olajuwon #44
Bill Russell #26
Larry Bird #20
Magic Johnson #8


Hmm, where's Kobe you ask? #57

Harden BTW is currently #10, but that'll likely change as his numbers fall off as he leaves his prime. Same goes for Chris Paul who is currently #1 ever so slightly ahead of MJ.