Western Conference Finals

Now this a fun matchup. I'm gonna break it down in my own way because I'm like that.

When RedNation is on Offense-

Obviously with Magic the team would want to run up and down the court as much as possible. Rondo can help off the bench to allow RedNation to run 24/7. T-Mac and Chris Webber are fantastic compliments here on the break as they can fill the lanes beautifully. Lob city. Pierce can do his usually trailing spot up 3s. However, Horry33 has the athletes to slow them down enough. Clyde Frazier is arguably the best PG defender (tied with Payton) and has the ability to create a lot of turnovers from Magic and to slow down the offense. Clyde and Julius are also fast enough and athletic enough to slow down any fast breaks. While Kareem was no slouch, Hakeem was faster up and down the court IMO. Wes Unseld was a solid defender and knew where to be. So I feel like if Magic tries to push the tempo constantly, they will get but also give up a lotta easy buckets through turnovers.

In the halfcourt, there will probably be a lotta Kareem post ups. The spacing should be fine with Webber being able to hit open shots. Dale Ellis off the bench was a great shooter as well. Horry33 does have solid defensive players all around though. The only thing in the halfcourt is that all off RedNation's players except Dale Ellis bascially need the ball in their hands. T-Mac, Pierce, Webber and Kareem all want their touches. Rondo is basically useless without the ball. So while RedNation does have a ridiculous amount of talent, I'm not sure if they would love playing with each other as they wouldn't have the ball enough to be at their peak.

In the clutch, I am not sure how they work off each other. Do you just iso them? It seems like such a waste of talent. T-Mac was great in the PnR but Kareem didn't do much of that. I guess you dump it down to Kareem which is an awesome shot but it doesn't seem perfect since Magic and T-Mac were spotty outside shooters and Horry33 has the speed and athleticism to help and recover.


When Horry33 is on Offense-

Well, Horry33 can also get up the court brilliantly and he is up against Magic and T-Mac who did not hustle as hard defensively as they could/should have. The turnovers created due to their athleticism, switching ability and Clyde's awesome defense will lead to a lot of easy quick baskets. Another thing that helps here is having the GOAT Outlet passer in Elvin Hayes. His quick passing should be able to allow Horry to switch from defense to offense extremely quickly. And with Drexeler and Erving on the wings, that would be extremely deadly. Despite Magic being with RedNation, I would give the quick fast break offense advantage to Horry33.

However, I don't see this team doing as well in the halfcourt. Clyde was a decent outside shooter but not amazing and that could hurt slightly. Frazier always stepped up in big games which is nice. I think Chris Mullin would play good minutes because his shooting would really open up the game for the rest of the team. Plus Wes Unseld who is also the GOAT pick setter would help a lot there. However, offensively I could see RedNation trying to funnel everything towards Kareem. That could leave him slightly vulnerable on the glass and foul trouble though.

Rebounding and Intangibles-

This is close to a wash. Magic was a fantastic rebounding PG but Wes Unseld, Drexler and Erving should take off any advantage for either side. Both teams have players who love to step up in the big moment and take the big shot.

Conclusion-

While I think RedNation has the slightly better offense, Horry has the better defense. Mullin and Dale Ellis can both come off the bench and shoot the lights out (slight advantage to Mullin though).


I think Erving is better than prime T-Mac and Drexler is better than Prime Pierce. In the end Walt Frazier manages to slow down Magic enough to allow Horry to win in 7.

Horry33 in 7. Very close. Hard to pick. In the end defense wins rings so I went with Horry33.

 

where's the east? :grin:

 

Why do two teams have Dr. J?

Horry33 and Shayan

 

twas' pippen on shayan's team.


@RedNation.. will vote tomorrow. too tired today

 

Frontcourt:

Pierce vs Erving - Erving

Don't think this needs an explanation.

Webber vs Unseld - Webber

Ditto.

Kareem vs Hakeem - TIE

Kareem has Hakeem on longevity, but on peak? About equal rebounders, Kareem is the better offensive player, and Hakeem is the better defensive player.

Ellis vs Mullin - Mullin

Close, but Mullin was the more complete player.

Sampson vs Schayes - Sampson

Tough to judge Schayes.

Double elimination?

Pierce vs Unsled - Pierce

Ellis vs Schayes - Ellis

We're just judging talent here, so...

RedNation

Backcourt:

Magic vs Frazier - Magic

By a decent margin.

McGrady vs Drexler - TIE

Drexler gets McGrady on longevity, but McGrady is right there with him and possibly surpasses Drexler in peak play.

Rondo vs Monroe - Monroe

Rondo's best is yet to come, for now, he's not Monroe.

Hakeem and Kareem were neck and neck, but right here, Magic is clearly the best player of the bunch.

RedNation

Bench:

Rondo, Ellis, and Sampson vs Monroe, Mullin, and Schayes

A lot of versatility on Horry33's bench.

Horry33

Offense:

Four proper ball movers on RedNation's starting lineup and great role-players on his bench. Think I've said this before, but that team can have 5, maybe even 6 or 7, different scoring leaders on any given night. Height to look and shoot over defenses. Outside shooting.

Horry33 has some great individual talents, but I don't see them meshing a great deal in the half-court.

RedNation

Defense:

Here's where Horry33 will have to make up some points. Frazier, Erving, and Olajuwon were all excellent defenders. The wildcard here is McGrady; he can definitely conserve his energy on offense to play a defensive role and cause some major damage with his length and athleticism. Still, we know Horry33's trio played complete games throughout their careers.
Horry33

Team Chemistry:

Don't see any real problems, just a better team chemistry on RedNation's team because of Magic.

RedNation

WHO WILL WIN IN A 7 GAME SERIES:

This probably turns into a Erving vs Magic series if Hakeem against Kareem predictably turns into a stalemater. In that case, I gotta go with Magic taking 4 games out of 7.

RedNation

 

my vote is for rednation

 

As i said on previous post on Horry's team, he will have a problem with this kind of matchup.

Horry33 don't have a distributor/pass-first point guard to feed their stars and most of the players rely on 1-on-1 matchups.

He can't win team basketball with that.

RedNation 4-2

 

Wanted to make a detailed analysis, but jumpman pretty much nailed it.

Just gonna add some of my own thoughts:

Looking at the frontcourt where Horry has Schayes(unathletic 50s player that would probably get raped vs. modern bigs) and the liability in Unseld(unathletic, undersized), I see the key element of this series.
Webber eats Unseld with his athletcism and versatiltiy on both ends, so Hakeem would have to help in certain situations. That leaves Kareem room to operate, which you never want as an opponent. When it comes to the bench, RedN has Sampson coming and raping Schayes, possibly playing PF too and murdering Unseld. Those two match-ups would be brutal for Horry's team.

I agree that Horry's backcourt looks better on paper, but as jumpman said, RedN's unit is extremely gifted with passing and ball-iq and has the right mixture of guys that can drive, dish or net the open jumper. This is incredibly helpful on transition and with Kareem, Magic you got guys that can post up in halfcourt. Horry has to almost completely rely on Mullin for 3s, which shows how the spacing of the starting unit is not as good as you want.


All in all, I see RedN winning in 6 or 7.

 

Is that 4-1?

Damn...I'll vote tomorrow if needed, it is 11:00pm down under. I have Sunday Church service tomorrow.

 

I don't see how I can lose chemistry. These guys were all former teammates

Hakeem and Drexler championship
Unseld and Monroe
Frazier and Monroe championship
Drexler and Mullin gold medal

Chemistry- The chemistry between Hakeem and Drexler is undeniable. They played on formidable teams during the Phi Slamma Jamma days at UofH and again on the way to the second Houston Rockets championship. Hakeem even choose Drexler to present Hakeem at his Hall of Fame enshrinement. And guess who Drexler had previously chosen to present him at his own Hall of Fame enshrinement? None other than Dr. J. That’s a lot of respect and love being shown between the best three players on my team. Need more chemistry? How about the fact that Wes Unseld and Earl Monroe were a perfect combination of inside and outside when they played together for the Baltimore Bullets. And what about when Monroe went on to New York and teamed with Walt Frazier to form what was known as the “Rolls Royce Backcourt” which lead the Knicks to the 1973 NBA championship. And during that run to the championship there was a young ball player growing up in New York that was studying the games of Knicks stars Frazier and Monroe and that player was a young Chris Mullin. Between Unseld, Monroe, Frazier, Mullin, Dr. J, Drexler, and Hakeem my players have a lot of experience winning with one another or looking up to one another in admiration. Oh and I didn’t forget about Dolph Shayes. Shayes, one of 7 nba top 50 players on my team, is the elder statesman on the team and like his teammates Erving and Mullin is a tough New York born baller. Again the links between my players off the court and the successful playing experiences on the court make my teams' chemistry the strongest of all the teams.

Frontcourt- Who better to start off your team than Hakeem Olajuwon. Michael Jordan was once asked to put together an all time lineup and he picked Hakeem for his center. Jordan said, “And the reason I would take Olajuwon is very simple: he is so versatile because of what he can give you from that position. It's not just his scoring, not just his rebounding or not just his blocked shots. People don't realize he was in the top seven in steals. He always made great decisions on the court. For all facets of the game, I have to give it to him.”Based on the rest of the team and Hakeem, I wanted to put a tough guy next to dream that wouldn’t need a lot of shots so I went with the hard-nosed Wes Unseld. For the younger voters think of an old school Kevin Love. In fact Kevin Wesley Love is named after Wes Unseld. Unseld was very strong, an exceptional rebounder and is famous for perfecting the outlet pass off his many rebounds that started fast breaks. And this is the style my team will play looking to turn defense into offense. And if you are going to run who better to be on one wing and gracefully finish fast breaks than Julius Erving aka Dr. J. He was a 11 time All-Star between the NBA and ABA. He was Jordan before there was a Jordan.

Backcourt- I know your still thinking about Dr. J and how awesome he was on those fast breaks. But if anybody was going to compare himself with Doc when it comes to running out and finishing effortlessly it would be Clyde Drexler. Clyde “The Glyde” Drexler. Never has there been a more fitting nickname for that perfectly captured how he floated through the air. All throughout his prime he was the 2nd best shooting guard only to Michael Jordan. Drexler took two not-so talented Blazers teams to the NBA finals before winning it all with Houston his 3rd time around. To go along with the smooth Clyde Drexler who better the super smooth and stylish Walt “Clyde” Frazier. What I wanted from my point guard was a leader, somebody who could run the offense, and play great defense. I got all those things in Frazier. He was the floor general for the Knicks only 2 championships in franchise history. For younger judges, imagine an old school Gary Payton as a good comparison. Frazier was on the All-Defensive First Team seven times during his career.

 

oh em gee...

ill come back to judge this one... ill never get yeardwork done if i judge this first...

 

well i guess my vote doesnt count so i will resist the elaboration but i woulf have voted for horry33... was my favorite team and who i had pegged to win it all...

oh well...

 

pg:Walt Frazier < Magic Johnson
sg:Clyde Drexler > Tracy McGrady
sf:Julius Earving > Paul Pierce
pf:Wes Unseld = Chris Webber
C: Hakeem Olajuwon = Kareem Abdul Jabbar

Bench:
G;Earl Monroe > Rajon Rondo
F:Chris Mullin > Dale Ellis
Colph Shayes > Ralph Sampson




My team got jipped. I've put together the better roster with 8 hall of famers but judges want to pretend like they know who will win based on perceived chemistry.

 

you would have won on my vote and maybe the entire draft if you have rondo/nash/cousy type of point guard. You don't have a playmaker. Frazier is a shoot-first pg.. That's what i think the other judges are looking when you talk about chemistry and not "they play with each other" thing.. Sorry. but it could have gone either way, IMO