Was Rudy Gay dragging the Grizz down?

I say yes just because the Batman is willing the Grizzlies deep into the postseason! Go Battier! :grin:

 

I don't think it was so much Gay dragging them down, as it was the Battier trade lifting them up. Shane was the veteran leadership they needed. He knows how to play in tight situations against overwhelming odds during the playoffs(thanks to his stint here). His 3 against the Spurs in game 1 gave them the convidence to be where they are now.

 

I think it was more that everyone is pitching in now, rather than deferring to Rudy. He wasn't dragging the team down; but when he played the team wasn't "wanting" it.

 

They don't seem to have gotten worse without Gay. You can see where his offense would help them, but maybe there is a chemistry issue on both ends of the court. I think you have to wait until next season. If Memphis takes off and competes for a top 4 seed, this notion is nonsense. If they once again compete just to make the playoffs, there may be something to this.

Ideally for them, they will continue playing this way and adding him back will only make them a better and more diverse team on offense.

 

Yea I have to reiterate this notion. When they traded for him, they had their first 'winnner' a guy who can mentally prepare the team and get them on page to win. Stats won't show the value of that, but his locker room adn court presence takes people like randolph, mayo, so on who are talented and athletic like the rest of the grizzlines and can put things together better and that is what we are seeing right now

 

I'm going to give you a serious answer, to begin with. After that, I can't tell you what I'll say.

Serious first:

First let me point out your argument hinges on one very questionable piece of evidence: that the regular season success or failure is an absolute indicator of the kind of basketball you are likely to see from a team.

There are holes in that theory because playoff basketball is about match ups, and exploiting advantages. Take the spurs for example, even with their gaudy record, many people felt that they weren't as good as their record because their style of play was more suited to the regular season. Conversely, many thought that the grizzlies (even without Rudy Gay, as they say) was a team nobody wanted to play. Part of the reason for this was because of the players we had allowed us to matchup with any team.

Another hole is that you fail to realize that, while our record against the league wasn't great, our record against the top teams in the west was. (Dallas & OKC, 3-1 Lakers, Spurs 2-2) which indicates that the grizzlies often played down to their competition. We lost, for example, the season series to NJ.

You also don't take into account that the grizzlies had injuries. Zach, Marc & Rudy were out at the beginning of the season and that cost us a lot of team chemistry (especially randolph's injury). When we were healthy (in the preseason) we went undefeated. It took time to get that back.

Then too, we had new players come to the team, all of which needed roles, ie Tony Allen. If you know anything about Lionel Hollins you know that he doesn't make knee jerk decisions, so OJ probably should have went to the bench far sooner than he did. It took a while for that to happen. Tony wasn't helping things with his lack of ball protection. He'd follow up a steal with a turnover. He'd break away only to miss a layup.

Having Shane is a blessing. There is no doubt. Because he provides us with a high level of production from Gay's position, and if Gay had of gone down after the trade deadline, we might not be in this spot. However, to pin a poor regular season record on Gay is highly suspect, and flat wrong. To say that Gay would have a negative effect on team cohesion is uninformed at best.

Having Gay back next year will solidify or small forward position. We won't have to play Sam Young at all. We will have Rudy and Shane.

 

Oh and I forgot: our early season schedule also combined with Zach and Marc's injury was a BIG factor. We were on the road against the best teams in the league and could not get back our team chemistry so easily.

Maybe the single biggest factor of all, along with the recognition that Tony Allen should replace Mayo in the starting lineup.

 

In a way, yes....they lacked a true heirarchy with Gay and Randolph playing, now they have one go to guy and the rest fall in line.

Also, both Gay and Zach are not great defenders, so you replace Gay with a better defender and the team is better for it overall.

DD

 

The Grizzlies were on a roll several games before Battier arrived and while Rudy Gay was still playing.

While I don't think they're a better team without him, it does appear that (for this team) he didn't make that big a difference. With Randolph upping his game to near superstar level, and Tony Allen's improvement, they've been able to cover for his absence.

 

I'll put it this way: the most important part of this team is Randolph's low post scoring. So in a way you are right, we can survive without Gay so to speak.

The thing is, if all we have is randolph and defense we might have a limit as to how far we can go, I hate to say it because hopefully we can win it all this year.

Gay is the piece that can take us to the elite level. He is the counterpoint to Randolph, he is our closer. With him, we would not have lost that triple overtime game, most likely.

 

Do you think that without the Battier trade and if Rudy Gay was healthy, the Grizzlies would be the favorites (or, at least, on par with anyone else)?

 

Yes.

You have to remember that the grizzlies are starting Sam Young and you all see what a liability he has been. Also, even before battier we were the top rebounding team, top team at points in the paint, top team in steals. All before Battier.

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad we have battier, but he didn't MAKE this team. He compliments it.

 

Is this how a majority of Grizzlies fan feel, do you think? Or are opinions on this topic pretty scattered? Do they feel that adding Rudy Gay next year will elevate the team to another level, or that they should look to trade him for multiple other pieces?

 

we aren't trading gay, although many teams WANT him. It's funny that sports writers still believe that they can orchestrate trades by drumming up their own controversy. Everybody feels the way I do. Go to our board and you'll see this very subject being discussed.

the whole idea behind it is that they think that the grizzlies can't afford to sign gasol with rudy's contract, which steams back from the pau salary dump and which: Mike Conley, Rudy Gay, Randolph and now it is Marc Gasol will be traded to avoid a big pay day.

i assume that one it gets to oj they will stop saying it, but he is the only guy, out of our core that the grizzlies may not retain his services.

Go back and read the articles durvasa. About how we are going to trade gay for tayshaun prince. Randolph to Orlando for god knows who. Conley's contract was premature and now it is cycled again because of playoff sucess without gay. LOL

 

losing gay didn't make them more talented but it did make them play smarter. they are giving more shots to zbo and gasol who both shoot a higher % which equals higher potency on offense.

i don't think they can or should trade gay to get better. right now their weakest position is small forward. they already have a good small forward in gay. if he comes back and falls into line as a 3rd option i think they have a team with no real weaknesses.

only if gay can't accept that new role on offense should he be traded.

 

DEFINITELY. His lack of defense and ballhogging ways was slowing them down. Replace him with Allen/Battier (2 guys who are beasts on defense and fit well in a team ball system), look at the defense now and look at Z-Bo now.

 

Im pretty sure Rudy can make a wide open 3

 

Mr. Glue willing them beyond their normal capabilities.

 

In the games memphis lost, it really showed how much they miss rudy. Having a 1a option is always helpful and he places pressure on durant offensively. Not to mention, he's a shot maker. The rockets played better without yao when he went down, but that didn't mean they were a better team.