Two Die in High Speed Chase

I think armed robbery (which this turned out not to be, but would have been the best guess for the cops based on available information) is one of those chase worthy cases.

 

How long was the car being chased before it ran the red light and killed the two innocent people? What constitutes a chase? One minute? Two minutes? Ten minutes?

I dont think anyone can argue that the lights and sirens shouldnt have been turned on at least for a minute to try and stop these guys. Once thats done, then you cant say whether or not the death would have happened. You also cant say whether or not these people were murderers. You cant even say with any great certainty that there werent hostages involved.

I have no problem with the chase. I have a problem with th elack of coordination on police officers part though. WHenever there is a high speed chase going on for at least 5-10 minutes, roads should be cleared, more preventitive measures should be taken, and the like.

 

Hold the phone, the police weren't the ones committing a crime, and they weren't the ones that killed two innocent people. People are saying that the police should have never chased them, I don't know, maybe those guys shouldn't have robbed a place! I'm sure THAT would have prevented it!

 

True, but the police also made decisions that had an effect on the eventual outcome of two innocent deaths. Ottoman is correct that there has been a movement for quite awhile from a multitude of interests to get police to rethink policy pertaining to high speed pusuits.

It is true that:

If these alleged criminals had not robbed the cigarettes, the two innocents would probably not have been run into and killed.

If the police had made the decision to stand down, once the chase reached a certain point (considering speed, other traffic, openness of the road etc), the two innocents would probably not have been run into and killed.

These police are not CRIMINAL, but they are contributors to the deaths. Is there split second decision making going on? Yes. Did the police have time to reconsider the chase as it was in progress? Yes. There ARE cases of police standing down in such situations when they felt the danger to others on the road outweighed the danger posed by the fleeing criminals. No one wants to hang these cops out to dry, just reform the high speed procedures and train the cops when to, and when not to continue pursuits.

 

Cops are held to a higher standard than crooks

You would have it any other way
Do you prefer we see them the same as Crooks

Rocket River
The crooks are not seen in a better lite
in fact crooks are stupid and ignorant and evil
by definition . . . Cops however are not

 

If police don't chase "small-time crooks", then that gives criminals free reign. They will then know that if they speed away, cops won't chase them.

 

When you weigh out the cost to society, it is much more preferrable to let 'small time crooks' go than to contribute to the deaths of innocent people. Deterrence and/or punishment of small time crime is not worth someone's life. And even if police departments DID change their procedures, they wouldn't just let anyone go. They'd be trained to recognize which situations to pursue and when to let someone go. Remember, these two people are not the only one's who've been killed as innocent bystanders during a high speed police pursuit.

 

I do want them all compared to the same standard. I do not want the bar lowered for cops though, I want it raised for everyone else. These criminals would not have even faced prison time for stealing cigarettes. That is petty theft. Instead they will likely face manslaughter charges and go to prison for a long time. There was no gain in running from the cops. If we would concentrate on that, and on how there are consequences not only for commiting the crime, but for fleeing as well, maybe we could convince a couple of theives to just give up once they have been spotted. Instead, everyone focuses on how the high speed chase produced two deaths. Blame is shifted. Now the police are seen as the bad guys. The crooks are just petty theives. All they did was steal some cigarettes. The cops came along and caused two deaths. Now theives look at this and say, "Maybe the cops won't chase me if I do this." Instead of reducing crime we increase it. That is why I don't want the buck passed to the cops who where doing there job. The cops didn't make the criminals flee at high speed, they just followed them.

 

Cops fault. They should be sued, or at the very least, go to jail. They should have just let those guys go. They weren't dangerous.

 

Again, how would the police KNOW that these weren't dangerous criminals? How long did the chase continue?

This was a judgment call by the police. It is very possible that they used good judgment, but we do not know ALL of the details so it is not possible to assess. We certainly do ot have enough information to indict the police.

What if a clerk was lying dead on the floor, and the police had not given chase?

 

Was there anyway the cops could have asked for a road block, so they wouldn't go on a long journey?

 

Two points I think this discussion boils down to:

First, Are we shifting blame to the cops when the responsibility should rest with the criminals?

I don't think anyone is absolving the criminals of responsibility. No one is writing about it because everyone has already decided that 'Yes, if they had not stolen or run these innocents would not have died.' But that doesn't mean that the police did not contribute to these deaths. If the criminals had not been chased past a certain point, they would (probably) not have been driving like a bat out of hell and lost control and hit the innocents.

Second, would crime increase if cops did not pursue? Or would we want them not to pursue if the clerk had been hurt?

It important to remember that in no situation would the police just stand there while the criminals drove off. Even in the places where there are more strict procedures for high speed chases, the cops DO CHASE criminals. But they make evaluations DURING the chase as to the dangers that the chase may pose to the general public. If there is heavy traffic, high pedestrian flow, or if the criminals reach a speed in an area that makes an accident inevitable, the police can stand down.