Inflation adjusted stagnation, meaning wages rise with inflation, is not real decline though. I see you did choose to cherry pick some numbers though. Congrats. According to the CBO, average wages for both the middle and bottom quintile have increased above inflation between 1979 and 2007. I guess since I could cherry pick some numbers, everything must be honky dory. I did read it. I will repeat my response, because you seem to have missed the connection last time. You can't use the gap between the middle class and the upper class to argue about a threat to the American dream. Upward mobility is about individuals moving up. Wealth disparity is about the gap between classes. You can look at the ease or difficulty of moving between wealth strata, but a rising gap between the haves and the have nots has little to do with the dream of moving from one to the other, especially when the gap is not so much between the haves and the have nots as it is between the quite well off and the preposterously wealthy. That means that intergenerational mobility is an ENTIRELY SEPARATE discussion from the wealth gap. In theory there could be an enormous wealth gap and high intergenerational mobility, or a tiny wealth gap and zero intergenerational mobility. There may be some connection between them, but posting about one is not any evidence for the other, nor does it show any causal relationship.
When the top 5% sees an increase in inflation adjusted income of nearly $75,000 (more than the bottom 50% sees in total income), I would expect the rest of the income distribution to see some increase. However, I guess they should just "be happy at the same level now" even though they are FAR more productive than they were 20 years ago. http://money.msn.com/how-to-invest/its-a-recovery-only-if-youre-rich-mirhaydari.aspx?page=2 So, because "America has a very high standard of living," all of the gains in the economy should go to the top 1%? I agree that unemployment is a bigger issue than income inequality, but the only solutions (to unemployment) being put out by people you support are to cut taxes even lower than the historically low levels they are at now. They keep claiming that if we keep cutting taxes, jobs will just get created, but that hasn't happened. Businesses are sitting on huge troughs of money and aren't hiring because there just isn't demand. It is kind of funny how when we had a top tax rate over 90%, CEOs made about 40 times what their average workers make (as opposed to the 1000 times or more we see today) and families were able to make it with a single salary. These days, it takes two salaries to make it in many markets and most families still find it necessary to rack up huge amounts of credit card debt to make ends meet. I think these situations are related, as we have catered to the wealthy we have cut the middle class off at the knees. The middle class is the engine that will get our economy back on track, we need to cater to them, not the wealthy.
Even if you were to defend increasing wage inequality as a "neutral" variable in economic models (which is empirically speaking, nonsense---greater inequality does lead to bad economic effects other than "jealousy", see my other post), your "side of the story" is that median real wages have increased a little bit from 1979-2007 (and declined most recently from 2000-2008, and god knows what happened after 2008, though you can bet subsidized Minsky moment destruction of middle class assets and employment opportunities, one of the chief causes of the anger here, have worked their magic---you cherry pick your time frame, I cherry pick mine), so therefore, OWS is just "jealous", and should "content themselves" with whatever they get. Mhmm. This is all about jealousy of the upper class. Judeo-Christian values tell us to keep your horses silent; of course, Judeo-Christian values also tell us to care for the poor, not buy up cocaine in ridiculous amounts, and spend $1000/hr on escorts, but what about it? That was my point with inter generational mobility. It's not just that there's an increasing wage disparity, and oh, people are so jealous. It's the very fact that the American dream is being threatened---people cannot move up, and face a distinct threat of moving down. The rich are becoming richer and more entrenched. Even in your nice little world where protesters should be nice Judeo-Christian sheep (instead of "greed is good" mongers that the free market demands they be), the sheep were promised that a rising tide lifts all boats. Now, it turns out that rising tide only brought some boats up, and capsized the rest. (if you consider median real wage stagnation from 1979-2007 "neutral", what about the effects of 2008 after, completely brought to you by Goldman et al.?) ex: We're talking about the largest asset of most middle-class families. Couple that with losses in their 401k and etc., how's that for stagnation and cherry picking years? If the CBO had gone just a few months later, I think the figures might have caused a riot, though the truth is obvious for all that choose to see.
Interesting thread and interesting, but specious arguments from stupidmoniker. The "Americann Dream" and the "Bible" and perhaps the good old days of mom and apple pie, support the current deal of the upper 1%. Per stupidmoniker first we have the fraudulent Biblical argument that Jesus I guess was perfectly fine with having a few very very rich people and having people who are literally hungry or cold or dying or in needless pain or perhaps psychosis from lack of medicine. Envy of presecription meds is the new most deadly sin. Second we have a fraudulent attempt to shrink the American Dream to a living standard for most that hasn't gone up in a generation. About ,80% of Americans can only hope, at most forever, under the "American Dream" as defined by stupidmoniker, for the actual income of 1979. They should shut up and be happy about this or again the deadly sin of "envy". Why not claim "class warfare" also? Granted the economy is not totally a zero sum game so let's keep beating that dead horse. That doesn't mean that most Americans see the American Dream as one in which nearly all present and future gains in economic wealth go to the upper 1 percent with another 19% receiving some and the other 80% receiving none. Given the morality or good old fashioned values of the upperr 1% having an increased portion of the economic pie why complain about perpetual per Reagan 1979 living standards for the lower 80% according to stupidmoniker. I would just hope the GO would proudly make this clear to the public their version of the "American Dream". Good try. Now give us the conservative think tank that gave you some of your talking points, though I have to think that money could buy better arguments than that for the upper 1% and you failed to include some of their other talking poinnts, you can do better.
$400 million per F-22. It creates jobs but could we not have put the time, money and effort towards something else? As a 99% I would like to have seen this money spent on nuclear energy propoganda, soil conservation and building mass public transit systems in all major U.S. cities - good ones, not like the Fanin rail line.
Just another day in the new Amerika Daily Kos says that was today in Oakland. What's that Mom thinking? Saw this comment: The only tank in Oakland is the Warriors' season, amirite?!
25 hugely interesting minutes if you are a a business ethics/tax code nerd. Business is Darwinian and will use any method it can to make a profit, including buying the government. The only counter is transparency and an informed electorate. 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Absolutely true. But for us, unfortunately this is a chicken-egg trap. Can't get transparency cause we're too stupid to vote for it. Can't get smarter voters cause we don't have information transparency. Rinse repeat.
The fact that you are not banned proves to me how bias this forum is. Just pray to God that you will never run into me in real life, I will gladly administer an ass whopping to you and face the consequences. You are a nasty,perverted creep who hides behind your keyboard and never had the proper upbringing to act like a real man!
When are you going to join them and go protest Obama? http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/11/30/occupy-protesters-mobilize-for-obamas-visit/
