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Championship teams of the last 2 decades rebuilt around Guards

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by jaiaguilar, Jul 15, 2021.

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  1. jaiaguilar

    jaiaguilar Member

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    Drafting and building around big men in the last 2 decades has not been a sound franchise rebuilding strategy.

    Now don't get me wrong, i really like Mobley. I think he will be a great NBA player and is much closer to a Anthony Davis/Bosh then a James Wiseman/ Marvin Bagley. I'm also under no delusion that having a Anthony Davis, Garnett, Shaq, Ayton, Bosh type big man is KEY in winning a chip BUT you sign/trade for them don't draft them.

    We shouldn't draft a great bigman only for us to stay on the mediocrity mill and then be trade them to a contender - look at the history of lottery big men as centrepieces in rebuilding franchises:

    Anthony Davis (Pelicans) - Traded to the Lakers championship team
    Chris Bosh (Raptors) - Traded to the Heat
    Shaq (Orlando) - Traded to the Lakers
    Pau Gasol (Grizzlies) - Traded to the Lakers
    Garnett (Timberwolves) - traded to Boston

    Now look at the Championship teams of the last 2 decades and who were their foundational pieces?

    Heat started with Wade SG - which brought in LBJ and Bosh
    Warriors started with Klay SG and Steph PG - then drafted green, traded for KD in their championship runs
    Lakers started with Kobe SG - then traded for Shaq and all the other stars
    Celtics started with Pierce SG - then the big 3
    Suns started with Booker SG - then drafted Ayton

    You might say the Spurs Tim Duncan but he was really the exception and their stars really came in a package rather then rebuilding around him per se.

    SO i know it may be very enticing to Draft Evan Mobley and heck he may even be the BEST player in the draft. I still wouldn't draft him if i were the Rockets. We need to build around a Guard.

    It's a guards league, they put bums in seats and attract fans and other great players. Think about our own run for championships with James Harden. We started with him and look what i brought us. Dwight Howard, Chris Paul, and Westbrook.

    We need to prioritize:
    1.Cade (I wish!)
    2.Green
    3.Suggs
    All of which would most likely be #1 overall picks in most drafts.

    It's not going to be the end of the world if we draft Mobley, we just need to find a superstar guard quick or our rebuild will go t*** up very quickly.
     
    #1 jaiaguilar, Jul 15, 2021
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  2. BallSoHarden

    BallSoHarden Member

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    I made this same point in another thread, I think the last time a center won as the best player on a team that he was drafted by was probably the Rockets, so maybe people are living in the 90s still.

    Also, a center as your best player is not going to win you anything. That is why I do not believe in Philly. Centers like Bam and Ayton work in this league, but you have to have elite guards around them.
     
    #2 BallSoHarden, Jul 15, 2021
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  3. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Do the Spurs and Mavs not count?
     
    #3 cmoak1982, Jul 15, 2021
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  4. BallSoHarden

    BallSoHarden Member

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    Neither had a center that they drafted as their best player and won a championship with. Tim Duncan was a PF, and the Mavs won with Tyson Chandler, he was neither their best player nor was he drafted by them.
     
    #4 BallSoHarden, Jul 15, 2021
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  5. jaiaguilar

    jaiaguilar Member

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    Dirk was a freak and far from the prototypical 'anchor your defense type bigman' even by modern standards. He's literally a 1 off. Don't forget - Andrea Bargnani! (1st overall pick)
     
    #5 jaiaguilar, Jul 15, 2021
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  6. BallSoHarden

    BallSoHarden Member

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    PF vs Center, also those guys had elite offensive skills from the beginning, same as AD. Mobley is not elite offensively.
     
    #6 BallSoHarden, Jul 15, 2021
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  7. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Duncan was a center, at minimum he was a big man.
     
    #7 cmoak1982, Jul 15, 2021
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  8. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    True, but still a big man. Interchangeable at the 4&5
     
    #8 cmoak1982, Jul 15, 2021
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  9. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    Mobley is interchangeable in the front court.
    I’m not advocating for him, I’m just saying there’s some recent big men that have been best player on a team to win rings.
     
    #9 cmoak1982, Jul 15, 2021
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  10. jaiaguilar

    jaiaguilar Member

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    If we did draft him, the rockets would need to tank hard the next season and draft a great SG talent to pair with him quick or else our rebuild is going t*** up. Only other question is, will you be able to find a Cade, Green or Suggs type talent? even if you got #1 overall pick?
     
    #10 jaiaguilar, Jul 15, 2021
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  11. cmoak1982

    cmoak1982 Member
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    I think I personally would like Cade or Green and some long 3&D types later in the draft. Hope for Chet or Paolo next year.
    Cade, Green, Sengun, Murphy, Kispert, Jalen.
    Would like 2-3 of them
     
    #11 cmoak1982, Jul 15, 2021
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  12. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    If Green and Suggs were better players, I'd support picking them. Mobley is just considerably better than them AND we already have a team completely filled with guards. If we can't dump Wall, neither Green or Suggs would even start.
     
    #12 Bobbythegreat, Jul 15, 2021
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  13. D-rock

    D-rock Member

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    AD shot 15% from 3P.

    Mobley is 30% from 3P.
     
    #13 D-rock, Jul 16, 2021
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  14. i3artow i3aller

    i3artow i3aller Member

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    I wouldn't be overly concerned with Mobley's loyalty. Pretty sure I saw he remained at the same high school and played with the same AAU team while coming up. Found the clip.
     
    #14 i3artow i3aller, Jul 16, 2021
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  15. DrNuegebauer

    DrNuegebauer Member

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    I'm not sure your examples make the point you wish them to make?

    Heat - with Wade didn't move the needle. Won on the back of Shaq; LBJ and Bosh.
    Warriors - Steph didn't move the needle, won on the back of Draymond Green's winning culture and signing Igoudala
    (etc)

    Of the teams who built around a foundational piece, you could argue that of the teams you mentioned, only the Spurs managed it - but is that because they managed to obtain the best PF of all time?

    In the end you need to have multiple stars to win - that's what we are seeing. And the best teams tend to have all-star talent as a guard and as a big. I'll take all-star talent, no matter where it comes from.
    Cade is my dream, but whomever we get, hope they are a star and not a bust!!
     
    #15 DrNuegebauer, Jul 16, 2021
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  16. ARA71197

    ARA71197 Member

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    Yep. This is why I want the Rockets to establish their backcourt and then add pieces around them. Rockets have picks and will eventually have cap space, so I like what I'm seeing already. I know KPJ has had off court issues, but the fact that Stone got him for free AND while on his rookie contract is unreal. Transitioned to PG in G League and now he can be seen as a key part of the foundation of the upcoming rebuild. I like the direction in which this team is headed
     
    #16 ARA71197, Jul 16, 2021
  17. jaiaguilar

    jaiaguilar Member

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    100% i'm not saying that a superstar guard is all you need. But if you look back on those teams its been their blueprint for a successful rebuild. The rockets weren't good with just Harden. They got good because they built around him with stars like Howard, CP3 and Westbrook.

    Guards are marketable they put bums on seats. They can become the face and brand of the franchise. And if Green or Suggs become superstars they will attract the elite bigs and glue guys and complimentary stars
     
    #17 jaiaguilar, Jul 16, 2021
  18. HTownTmac1

    HTownTmac1 Member

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    What about the bucks ?
     
    #18 HTownTmac1, Jul 16, 2021
  19. ElPigto

    ElPigto Member
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    When AD was drafted, big men weren't required to be good three point shooters. Not an apples to apples comparison.
     
    #19 ElPigto, Jul 16, 2021
  20. Trackwell

    Trackwell Member

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    That’s what I was thinking clueless
     
    #20 Trackwell, Jul 16, 2021
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