looks like durbin has just cut you off at the knees. he abjectly, tearfully apologized on the floor of the senate yesterday. WM Video Link: http://treyjackson.net/files/durbinap.wmv http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050621...yMIqhis0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTA3b2NibDltBHNlYwM3MTY- -- Sen. Durbin Apologizes for Gitmo Remarks By GLEN JOHNSON, AP Under fire from Republicans and some fellow Democrats, Sen. Dick Durbin apologized Tuesday for comparing American interrogators at the Guantanamo Bay prison camp to Nazis and other historically infamous figures. "Some may believe that my remarks crossed the line," the Illinois Democrat said. "To them I extend my heartfelt apologies." His voice quaking and tears welling in his eyes, the No. 2 Democrat in the Senate also apologized to any soldiers who felt insulted by his remarks. "They're the best. I never, ever intended any disrespect for them," he said. The apology came a week after Durbin, the Senate minority whip, quoted from an FBI agent's report describing detainees at the naval base in a U.S.-controlled portion of Cuba as being chained to the floor without food or water in extreme temperatures. "If I read this to you and did not tell you that it was an FBI agent describing what Americans had done to prisoners in their control, you would most certainly believe this must have been done by Nazis, Soviets in their gulags or some mad regime — Pol Pot or others — that had no concern for human beings," the senator said June 14. The comment created a buzz on the Internet and among conservative talk radio hosts, but Durbin initially refused to apologize. "This administration should apologize to the American people for abandoning the Geneva Conventions and authorizing torture techniques that put our troops at risk and make Americans less secure," he said the day after his initial comments. By last Friday, Durbin was trying to clarify his comments, yet the White House and top Republicans, including Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, refused to relent. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, in an interview scheduled for broadcast Wednesday on Fox News Radio's "The Tony Snow Show," tried to equate the comment with actress Jane Fonda calling U.S. soldiers war criminals during a visit to North Vietnam in 1972. On Tuesday, Chicago Mayor Richard Daley — a fellow Democrat — added his voice to the chorus of criticism, saying, "I think it's a disgrace to say that any man or woman in the military would act like that." During his apology, which Durbin delivered while looking directly into a TV camera broadcasting the proceedings, the senator said: "I made reference to Nazis, to Soviets, and other repressive regimes. Mr. President, I've come to understand that's a very poor choice of words." He also reached out directly to Holocaust survivors, adding: "I'm sorry if anything that I said caused any offense or pain to those who have such bitter memories of the Holocaust, the greatest moral tragedy of our time. Nothing, nothing should ever be said to demean or diminish that moral tragedy." Immediately after the apology, Sen. John McCain (news, bio, voting record), an Arizona Republican and former prisoner of war, spoke in Durbin's defense. "All of us, I believe, who have had the opportunity to serve in public life from time to time have said things that we deeply regret. I know that I have. I would like to say that the senator from Illinois, he did the right thing, the courageous thing, and I believe we can put this issue behind us."
You can't go back, but if we could just rewind to the summer of 2001 and just had the FBI break up the terrorist plan... Could have and should have.
Durbin did the right thing. However, Durbin pretty much backed up everything I have been saying. He said that it was never intended to offend any servicemen(which I have been claiming from the beginning. They weren't the target of the comparison at all. It was wrong of others to lump them in with his comparison.) Durbin also said what a poor choice of words he used. I agreed and have since the beginning. As I said it was stupid for him to make the comparison. Reaching out to the Holocaust survivors was the right thing to do as well. I have specifically pointed out where the administration is NOT like the Nazis, Stalinist Russia, or Pol Pot. But nothing in his apology changes the parallels that I did mention that existed, or goes to show that it was ever directed at the military.
As a side note, on more than one occasion from my local media, I heard the POWs of WWII saying Germany actually did treat them humanely. They speculated because US was sticking to Geneva Conventions, the Germans felt the POWs under their control should receive the same courtesy reciprocally.
the only parallels that one could reasonably make are that pol-pot, stalin, hitler, and bush are all mono-gastric, bi-pedal, and carbon-based. other than that, all other such comparisons are meaningless.
quote of the day: "I call on those who question the motives of the president and his national security advisors to join with the rest of America in presenting a united front to our enemies abroad." --Dick Durbin, 1998 on the occasion of Bill Clinton's bombing of Iraq.
Having a policy that allows torture of prisoners and violating human rights is one other parallel that could be made, holding prisoners for an indefinite amount of time with trial, or charging them with a crime is an appropriate parallel in some of the examples as well. But because there are parallels doesn't mean that one should make a general comparison. There are many more differences, but that doesn't erase the parallels that are present. Unless you can show me that we aren't allowing any prisoners to be chained on the floor and forced to defocate and urinate on themselves, and that no prisoners aren't being held indefinitely without being charged, or given a chance to stand trial, then there are some parallels. Having parallels does not mean we are the exact by any means. But if you and Gnewt Gingrich want to keep pretending that things that exist don't exist go right ahead.
while not comparing the magnitude of their offenses, all the aformentioned men were/are ideologues with utter disregard for voices of dissent.
i don't have much regard for voices of dissent, at least when that voice is my three year old. does not make me a father-hitler?
so, pol-pot/stalin/hitler/bush/basso has no regard for the voice of dissent/basso's three year old/world opinion. does that sum it up?
you tell me, you're the one, along w/ the ever consistent FB, who insists on continuing to make ridiculous, scurrilous, over-wrought comparisons.
Basso, I did not make general comparisons at all. I said there were parallels. You have done nothing to show that the parallels weren't accurate. Furthermore I pointed out that because there were only certain parallels that were accurate and that general comparisons weren't appropo, it wasn't a good idea to make them among other reasons. I am consistent because the issues I was mentioning haven't been addressed. You have made attempts to show that the comparison doesn't apply in a general sense and I agree with you. You have claimed that somehow his specific comparisons applied to the military, and that hasn't been shown to be the case.
