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Is "Dwight needs a post-up game" seriously the only thing you can say?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by 2016Champions, Jan 22, 2015.

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  1. 2016Champions

    2016Champions Member

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    This semi-rant is directed towards general NBA fans, not you beloved clutchfans.

    Did you know Tyson Chandler ranks 1st in oRPM among centers? That's a pretty impressive feat for a center averaging 10.7 ppg and can't post-up to save his life. RPM is basically a measure of how well a player fits in with his team/system, so who your team mates are and who you coach is can largely affect a player's RPM. Last season Tyson Chandler only ranked 13th in RPM, largely thanks to Carmelo Anthony who seems to think pick-and-rolls will give him cooties or something. On the other hand, the Mavericks have ranked 1st in pick-and-roll usage by a significant margin these last few years, so it comes to no surprise at all that Tyson Chandler has fit right in there (again).

    DeAndre Jordan is another center who manages to be a plus on offense despite the lack of a post-up game. It's simple really, all you need to do is set good screens then run and jump really high. DeAndre doesn't even need the screen setting part apparently, his game is practically predicated around lurking under the rim waiting for lobs. Sounds r****ded but it's effective, he is actually spacing the floor this way because defenders must keep a body on him at all times down there in no man's land -- often much to Blake's delight. It's often a dilemma of poisons for opposing centers, whether or not to let DeAndre have an easy lob or see yourself on the poster of a Blake Griffin dunk. I mean just look at this and tell me how you're supposed to stop it..:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBAy8SXxaCo

    These two centers have made the short list of about a dozen centers with a positive oRPM, and Dwight Howard has every capability to be on that short list with them, but for reasons unknown he has been doing everything in his power to mess it all up with an obsessive desire to post-up. I blame all you sheepish fans who are clearly products of the media, products of the TV talk from the likes of Charles Barkley and Shaquille O'Neal who insist Dwight needs a post-up game. You morons have ruined Dwight Howard and Rockets basketball. If Kevin McHale was to use Dwight Howard the same way Stan Van Gundy used him -- in a pick-and-roll orientated offense -- I wouldn't have to suffer through endless Dwight post-ups where he turns the ball over on 20% of attempts. If the turnovers aren't bad enough, Dwight is shooting 39.56% (36/91) this season on hook shots. In contrast, Donatas Motiejunas is shooting 60% on hook shots (69/115).

    I have been crying for a good year and a half for Kevin McFail to stop trying to predicate the offense around Dwight post-ups, but he has been blinded with obsession with his shiny new toy. Ever since the Asik lost his starting job, the Rockets have been using the pick-and-roll on less than 13% of possessions despite ranking 1st in pick-and-roll efficiency. Fortunately, I think McHale is finally coming around as the glaze over his eyes is finally clearing up in regards to his biggest shiniest toy - Dwight Howard. In the last dozen games or so, the Rockets have been running a horns set with increasing frequency. Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gMxGTNw3UU#t=65
    Now if only we can get Dwight to set screens like he actually wants this to work, because his screens have been half-assed at best, and if you're wondering how big of a deal that is just take a look below at the effect Amir Johnson's screen setting has on his team mates. [​IMG]

    With all this being said, far too many sheepish fans focus far too much on the offensive end. Dwight hasn't sprinted back on defense even once this season, and I haven't heard anyone anywhere say anything about it - not even a squeak. Even after the Warriors, a jump shooting team that averages 30 points in the paint, scored 64 [expletive deleted] points in the paint against the Rockets a few nights ago, not one person pointed their finger at Dwight Howard who has failed to improve the Rockets defense since missing 12 games earlier this season. There was at least one moment in that game where he took longer than 10 seconds to trod past half-court, and that is just inexcusable. Even in the half-court, Dwight has very rarely been going out of his way to contest a shot. He will stand around the rim and bother the hell out of shots he can get to with a few slow steps, but you won't see him pouncing to contest a weak-side lay-up if he's 5 feet away -- those days are over. Dwight Howard's right knee is reportedly bone on bone, I mean just think: Brandan Roy. This is not good for the Rockets. It's weird as hell that no one is talking about any of this. The only thing you narrow-minded sheepish fans know how to say is "Dwight needs to learn how to post-up" rah rah rah... smh.
     
    #1 2016Champions, Jan 22, 2015
    1 person likes this.
  2. IzakDavid13

    IzakDavid13 Member

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    Best player in the NBA at playing Pick'n'Roll...doesn't want to run Pick'n'Roll.

    'Nuff said.
     
    #2 IzakDavid13, Jan 22, 2015
  3. cheke64

    cheke64 Member

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    Black set the best screens.
     
    #3 cheke64, Jan 22, 2015
  4. Jontro

    Jontro Member

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    Does Dwert even lift breh?
     
    #4 Jontro, Jan 22, 2015
  5. Easy

    Easy Boban Only Fan
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    Now that you are saying this. Dwight's blocked shot number has been in decline for two straight years.

    Per game: 5 years ago, 2.4; last year 1.8; this year 1.4
    Per 36 minutes: 5 years ago, 2.3; last year 1.9; this year 1.6
    Per 100 possessions: 5 years ago, 3.3; last year 2.7; this year 2.2
     
    #5 Easy, Jan 22, 2015
  6. RoxBeliever

    RoxBeliever Member

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    We do see Dwight's decline on defense. How many games have we said that Dorsey gives more effort on D than Dwight?
     
    #6 RoxBeliever, Jan 22, 2015
  7. rocketseagles07

    rocketseagles07 Member

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    You guys do realize Dwight is a max player correct? What other max player in the league has such a questionable offensive game? You guys keep talking about people like Tyson Chandler and comparing D12 to other centers. Tyson Chandler is the 5th OPTION ON HIS TEAM. I would be perfectly fine with him being a defensive guy who can block shots and defend at an elite level, IF he wasn't our second option and a MAX PLAYER
     
    #7 rocketseagles07, Jan 22, 2015
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  8. napalm06

    napalm06 Huge Flopping Fan

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    Are we paying the salaries? Because if we are, I am pissed off!

    The OP makes a decent point. The Howard we've seen the last 20+ games is not the Dwight Howard we know he can be - for various reasons (injuries, effort, play design).

    If he plays like he did last year versus Portland, this conversation is moot.

    Last night, you could tell the referees got in his head and took him out of the game early. He made his usual dumb push-off decisions, but the refs don't allow Dwight the same contact as his opponent. I'm not sure how to solve that one.
     
    #8 napalm06, Jan 22, 2015
  9. SeekingAlpha

    SeekingAlpha Member

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    How many points do Tyson Chandler and DeAndre Jordan average? How many points does Dwight Howard average?

    How much do Chandler and Jordan get paid? How much is Dwight getting paid?

    I've said it many times before. Dwight will post up to get his all-star offensive numbers, to the detriment of this team.
     
    #9 SeekingAlpha, Jan 22, 2015
  10. WinkFan

    WinkFan Member

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    The problem with guys like Jordan and Chandler is that while they are super efficient, they only give you 10 points on 6 shots. That means you have to get points somewhere else.
     
    #10 WinkFan, Jan 22, 2015
  11. SemisolidSnake

    SemisolidSnake Member

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    Hmm, well, I was interested, so according to Basketball-Reference.com, here are the three of them for 2014-2015:

    Points per 100 Possessions:

    DeAndre Jordan: 15.1
    Salary: $11,440,124

    Tyson Chandler: 17.6
    Salary: $14,598,888

    Dwight Howard: 25.4
    Salary: $21,436,271

    Just trying to be useful. I have no real commentary here.
     
    #11 SemisolidSnake, Jan 22, 2015
  12. Juxtaposed Jolt

    Juxtaposed Jolt Member

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    It's not really a problem, though. If they only demand the ball 6 times, that opens up the entire court.

    Dumping it down to Dwight 85% of the time just doesn't work.
     
    #12 Juxtaposed Jolt, Jan 22, 2015
  13. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

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    Does anyone doubt that Dwight could be a 20/14 player if he played the pick and roll and crashed the boards like he used to?

    It is beyond frustrating watching this guy throw away his gifts trying to be something he is so desperately far from ever being. First thing that needs to happen is McHale needs to go to Dream and tell him to quit filling Dwight's head with nonsense about how he should be an offensive god on the court.
     
    #13 Dave_78, Jan 22, 2015
  14. SuperMarioBro

    SuperMarioBro Member

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    I can't deny that I have been one of those incorrigible fools who keeps complaining about Dwight's post game... I wouldn't complain about it if I didn't see it, and I never wanted us to go down there to him, but I did want him to improve his post game.

    You make a good point, though, OP, that this is probably not really necessary. Especially given the other pieces on this team. I've seen the light... F*** Dwight's post game. Let him play his game.

    It is strange how we ran the pick and roll way more with Yao and Mac than we do with Harden and Howard even though Yao's post game was *leagues* better than Dwight's... I guess that's in part because Yao was able to pop, and didn't always have to roll.
     
    #14 SuperMarioBro, Jan 22, 2015
  15. SuperMarioBro

    SuperMarioBro Member

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    He was getting those numbers without posting up or having any semblance of a post game in Orlando. I think the OP's point is that if we just let Dwight play his game and play to his strengths, he will fit in very well here and still put up great offensive numbers on lobs and garbage cleanup.
     
    #15 SuperMarioBro, Jan 22, 2015
  16. Yung-T

    Yung-T Member

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    Good thread but:

    Dwight needs a post-up game.
     
    #16 Yung-T, Jan 22, 2015
  17. WinkFan

    WinkFan Member

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    What does that mean,"open up the entire court"? If those guys take 6 shots, then a less efficient player gets more shots. If Dwight gets 6 shots, who is getting the other 5? Possibly Dmo, but he's unproven in that role. Otherwise, we don't have a lot of options.

    I'm not advocating for Dwight to post up. He's incapable of doing it because he can't shoot. Reducing him to Jordan/Chandler just won't cut it, though.
     
    #17 WinkFan, Jan 22, 2015
  18. SuperMarioBro

    SuperMarioBro Member

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    This thread needs more views and love. Bumping back to the front page.
     
    #18 SuperMarioBro, Jan 23, 2015
  19. tim562

    tim562 Member

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    Hate to say this, but Dwight is NOT a max player.
     
    #19 tim562, Jan 23, 2015
  20. SeekingAlpha

    SeekingAlpha Member

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    I disagree that he wasn't posting up in Orlando. He had no post game yes, but he was the focal point of their offense. With Nelson, Turkoglu, Rashard Lewis, and Courtney Lee spacing the floor all they had to do was dump the ball to Dwight and wait for the double to come. Can't exactly do that anymore since Dwight is no longer as spry as he previously was, and we our shooters aren't that great.

    And therein lies the problem. The game Dwight wants to play is NOT to his strengths.
     
    #20 SeekingAlpha, Jan 23, 2015
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