Kevin Martin named Western player of Week

The defintion of a star player is one who other stars want to come and play with. With that being said I don't see any other stars lining up to play with kmart

 

From reading on the forum, it seems the consensus is that Kevin Martin isn't a "star", because he can't create his own shot on an iso play at the end of the game. Could someone inform me why a team has to run an iso play at the end of the game? Why can't they run a normal play & get Martin his normal shot?

If there is a reason we have to run an iso play at the end of the game, are there any players out there who aren't stars (and thus more available) that happen to be very good at one-on-one play - like Cuttino Mobley was when he was with the Rockets?

 

Plays break down all the time...

 

The reason people talk about Martin's inability to create for himself on an "iso" play is because it forces Martin to rely on screens and off-ball movement to find an open shot. In the 4th quarter, good defensive teams really buckle down on those types of things, and it forces Martin to practically disappear from the Rockets offense.

Having a guy that can create on an iso play gives the team that person who can find a shot for himself (and others) when the defense starts playing much more aggressive and shutting down the off-ball movement. This is why over the past month and a half or so, Adelman started leaving Aaron Brooks on the floor in the 4th quarter more over Martin. AB could create his own shot (although, he struggled to hit the shots he created this season), Martin isn't that great at it. I will admit, though, it seems Martin has really started to turn up his aggression on offense in the 4th over the past few games, and it's really helped the team.

As far as non-stars that can create for themselves, the Rockets actually have one... his name is Terrence Williams. Unfortunately, it's not just about being able to create off an isolation play, it's also about making the correct decisions when you actually do it, and right now Williams doesn't really do that.

 

Really you can build around Gasol??

What happened in Memphis? He was there for 6.5 seasons, and Memphis build around him and never got a single playoff win.

 

Simply put, during a set play 3-5 players all have to be doing the correct things for the right player to get off the correct shot. When you iso, only one player has to get off his shot, meaning there are less things to go wrong and more people crashing the boards. When you add in more moving pieces, the play becomes more complex and the odds of it succeeding diminish. Not to mention the player that the set play is called for is typically not as good as most of the stars in the league.

Examples of non-star, iso players would be Stephen Jackson, J.R. Smith, Flip Murray, Ricky Davis, and most recently, Marcus Thorton.

 

The Rockets have a go-to for KM in the clutch. It's that oft-used curl off Scola that won us the Utah game. Game in NO, Lowry was the one feeding KM the ball instead of Shane. Yeah, it works. It enables KM to get a shot at the rim which he usually dunks. We use it when KM's outside shot is not falling late in the 4th.

RA has a read and react system. It requires BBIQ. The last two plays between Chuck and Brad that won us the game in NO were such kind of plays. Since NO bigs were showing hard on the screens on the perimeter guys, Chuck and Brad were sliding to the basket. It is making the defense pay when they overplay one guy.

We don't use set plays. We need guys though to find holes in the defense.

 

I read an advanced stat a few months ago (but still valid probably) that Martin is the 3rd best iso player in the league behind Dirk and someone else.

You people are clueless. Also as far as iso vs set play, I'll take Phil Jackson's opinions over mindless CF posters every day of the week.

 

First of all this is a great thread, and I hope Kevin Martin detractors go in here with an open mind to so that they can move past any misconceptions they might have had regarding "iso" players.

Everything depends on your mindset. If you do set plays all game long inevitably plays will break down at some point in time, that's how even a team as disciplined as the Spurs has to settle for Duncan taking a long 3 with Shaq right up his grill. However two things stand out from this:

1) How often do plays break down

2) What is the percentage an iso player will make the shot

You see, just being an "iso player" isn't enough, some players convert iso plays efficiently, while others (most notably Allen Iverson) are indeed iso players but convert iso plays at a horrible rate. Also, a team like the Spurs probably only break down a few plays a game, in that system iso players are less valuable than say GS, wherein iso plays occur almost every play.

Regarding Kevin Martin, the myth is he can't create plays on his own, however his high rate of freethrows tells me he can create pretty well, just that he does it differently than other guys (i.e. flopping all over the place). So he's not the guy who will make the clutch 3 with two defenders swarming all over him. However those kind of shots are bad shots, and while guys like Kobe are the ones you'd want to take those shots, out of 100 such shots the rate Kobe/Lebron/etc. will make them is still pretty small. KM oth will give you extremely efficient offense all game long. That kind of consistency isn't flashy, but to be quite honest I think that's more vital to a team actually aiming to win games rather than say Melo converting clutch shots at 35% but only scoring at a 45% clip overall. As much as sportscenter hypes it up, the clutch shot at the end of the game is still only 2 pts, and I'd rather have the guy who will give me the better performance 90% of the game.

 

Well said, someone who actually understand the Adelman offense.

When Adelman coached the Kings and they were winning all the time, they didn't have any go-to guy or iso player. Once in a while Vlade Divac would post up, but 99% of the time, the final shot was taken by whomever happened to be in the right spot based on the defense against them, and everyone was smart enough to make good reads. One night Webber, another night Bibby, or Peja, or even Christie. It's a team game.

 

Amen! Someone who understands the game and doesn't just watch ESPN highlights.

 

Just wanted to say thanks to everybody for their answers to my question.

 

By the way, I believe the consensus is that Kevin Martin is indeed a star.

 

This is one of the best threads from the this year's harvest. Not a single mind-numbing comment

 

I AGREE!!!..Dude plays like a STAR or IS A STAR...he Points more points then KOBE AND MELO ETC..or at least bout the same...Just cuz he miss some of his shots..but he drawl fouls...like durant, melo, kobe..etc...Obviously he just HEAR BIG NAMES...Kmart is a Good player.

 

PUT UP SCORE LIKE KOBE* correction. Sorry