An Islamic court and the word of some turkey is worth more than one's family when it comes to religion. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4563452.stm A Malaysian mountaineering hero will be buried as a Muslim, against the wishes of his Hindu wife, who denied he had converted to Islam before his death. The decision follows a High Court ruling that it cannot override the country's Islamic courts in matters of religious conversion. An Islamic court had said the man, M Moorthy, had become a Muslim last year. Lawyers say the case highlights problems faced by non-Muslims dealing with Malaysia's Islamic justice system. "So much for good interracial relations," Haris Mohamad Ibrahim, a lawyer representing Malaysia's Bar Council, told The Associated Press. "The judge has just told the widow and her family to go back and leave the body of their beloved to be buried by strangers." M Moorthy, 36, was a Hindu when he became a national hero in 1997 as a member of the first Malaysian expedition to conquer Mount Everest. But when he died a week ago family supporters and state Islamic officials jostled one another at the mortuary as each tried to claim his body. An Islamic Sharia court subsequently upheld a claim by his former colleagues in the army that he had become a Muslim last year. However his family, who want him to have a Hindu funeral, were not allowed to appear before the court to dispute his conversion because they are not Muslims. The family went to the civil court and argued that Mr Moorthy was a practising Hindu right up to a recent accident when he fell from his wheelchair and lapsed into a coma. They say he was even interviewed for local television two months ago about his preparations for the Hindu festival of Diwali. But the High Court agreed with government lawyers who argued the civil court had no jurisdiction. Lawyers for the dead man's relatives say the ruling leaves non-Muslims little protection in family disputes considered under Islamic law. Most Malaysians are Muslim but the country's constitution guarantees freedom of worship for all.
This is what seperation of church and state means... not a prohibition of a few municiple employees choosing to celebrate a holiday.
hey guys, the thing thats debateble here is wether or not his wife should get to bury him the way she wants, or the deceased gets to be buried in the way he wanted to. its not like the government is trying to make the dead guy a muslim just because he's a 'mountaineering hero'. the deceased converted to islam on 11 Oktober 2004. either he didnt tell his wife, or he did and she wants him buried according to her religion anyway. the thing about malaysia, is that if you want to convert to islam, you need to file it with a government office. and he did. and he's not the only muslim in his family, he had 2 other siblings who also converted to islam. he was in the army, most army men are malays who are muslims, and its very common that those who were of other religions to convert. i guess its got something to do with the bonds they share in their line of work. makes them assimilate to their friends.
[rquoter] The family went to the civil court and argued that Mr Moorthy was a practising Hindu right up to a recent accident when he fell from his wheelchair and lapsed into a coma. They say he was even interviewed for local television two months ago about his preparations for the Hindu festival of Diwali. [/rquoter]
Sounds like the Nazi party....a bunch of people just joined because it made life easier.......I believe that the new pope joined the Hitler Jugan for the same reasons. DD
The problem with this idea is that there are actual legal benefits to being a Muslim in Malaysia. Under Malaysian law there is a concept called "Bhumiputra" that gives Muslims Malays a leg up in things like bidding for government contracts, property disputes and other things over non-Muslims.
Interesting case... But if he needed to file paperwork to convert in Malaysia, then shouldn't that decide whether or not he should be buried as a Muslim or a Hindu? Seems more like a civil case to me. This very well could happen here in the states as well, btw, so don't quickly dismiss it as a religious-bias thing (although it very well could be). Look at it this way: what if the husband did convert, and his wife was so pissed off at his decision to do so and decided to go against his wishes and bury him as a Hindu? The opposite could also be true. This seems to me more like a civil case to decide what the husband's wishes were and who -- if his wishes were unclear or couldn't be proven -- would decide for him following his death. If you're the court, who do you believe/what do you do? Interesting legal case, not sure if it's ever been brought up here in the States before...
And...the bottom line.... What does it matter how he is buried, he is already dead and laughing his ass off at all the morons on earth that actually believe that any religion is even close to the truth. DD
i can give you articles that would dispute this story from the bbc, but its not in english. its not like i cant read the article posted above. its just that thats not the end all to the whole story. here's a picture of the funeral. <a href="http://img478.imageshack.us/my.php?image=29moorthy2qj.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/5465/29moorthy2qj.th.jpg" border="0" alt="Free Image Hosting at www.ImageShack.us" /></a> [img=http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/5465/29moorthy2qj.th.jpg] the guy that looks like an indian on the left is Mohd Hussin Abdullah, the deceased brother, who's muslim name is Mohammad Abdullah.
actually, thats not true. bumiputras are people that are considered to be natives of the land. and that includes malays (who are mostly muslims if not already all of them) and the aborigines (who are not muslims. there is also a group of chinese people that are considered bumiputras). so he cant attain that 'leg up' that way. lets not make the deceased as some scheming guy whos intentions of converting is other than for his spiritual reasons. are you the guy who i discussed about the bumiputra issue with in this bbs?
disregarding your usual there-is-no-religion quip, i kind of agree with everything else. i'm sure he doesn't care really, but those who do are his wife and her family, and the deceased's siblings who are muslims. she claims he's a hindu who should get the hindu burial. the siblings claim he's a muslim and therefore should have consented to having an islamic burial in his will. as far as i know, theres nothing in islam that disallows someone to get buried in other than the islam way, especially if its in a sensitive situation like this. in islam, its all as long as the body returns to the earth. the preferable method is that the body goes into the earth as soon as possible, without any alteration to the body (ie chemicals, etc). i think the court should have just let the widow have her way. its all the same really, and would have made her happy.
if im not mistaken, the term hindu burial is wrong. since hindus get cremated and if im not mistaken their ashes are spread in the ganga???
My understanding is that yes Bhumiputra refers to natives of the land and I believe the term actually means "Son of the soil" or something to that extent. I also have heard from Malaysians of Chinese descent that being a Bhumiputra does grant a lot of benefits, for instance I know a Kuala Lumpar architect who even though widely recognized as an innovative architect is pretty much shut off from any government countracts that are instead granted to bhumiputras. Also one of the reason for the split between Singapore and Malaysia was that Singapore being mostly Chinese and non-Muslim refused to recognize bhumiputra status. From what I've heard is that non-Malays can gain Bhumiputra status by converting to Islam and taking an Islamic name. I'll admit though that I've only heard this second hand but that would certainly explain why a Non-Muslim would choose to become to a Muslim. As far as I can recall this is the first time I've discussed Bhumiputras on this board.
those that get a leg up on government contracts unfairly is due to the corrupt nature of those in charge rather than them being bumiputras! those that are close to the ruling party, that have family relations, etc. the new PM is trying to make the govt more transparent, i'll believe it when i see it. converting to islam doesn't afford you bumiputra status. the indian-muslims group for example, who's had generations of born-muslims, are not afforded bumiputra status. there was even an appeal from their representative not too long ago. i think i had a discussion about bumiputras on this board once.
fba34; Are you Malaysian? I've lived and worked in Singapore so my knowledge of Bhumiputra mostly comes from what I've heard in Singapore. Since that was one of the issues that caused the split between Singapore and Malaysia some of what I've heard might be biased so if you are Malaysian you probably know more about it than me. That said. Given that Malaysia proudly trumpets its status as an Islamic Republic and very strongly encourages Islam, especially under Mahathir, it makes sense to me that Muslims would gain advantages over non-Muslims in Malaysia and that someone might even officially convert to Islam while still practicing some other religion in the privacy of their own home. Or even that the government might want to say that a prominent Malaysian was Muslim even when they never practiced.
