Israel announces largest West Bank land seizure since 1993 during Blinken visit

@Nook even the biggest Israeli supporters are tired

 

Should have given the Jews about 1/3 of Germany, and all the Swiss banks, post WWII

 

This is a big problem with so much going on in the world and human society in general. It’s easier to view things as “black” and “white”, “us versus them” ,“good versus evil” and everything is a zero sum game. Few things are that simplistic but because human nature is tribal it becomes easier to think about things in that way.

 

Lol. Same old propaganda. Poor ATW can't help it due to the guilt of what his Nazi ancestors did during the Holocaust. Historically Jews lived much more peacefully among their neighbors in Arab countries than in they did in Europe or Germany where ATW grew up. After the Nakba and the ethnic cleansing of Palestine, completely agains international law then and now, the relations between Jews in Arab countries and their Muslim neighbors did worsen.

 

Norman Ornstein is very moderate. The settlers, Netanyahu and their apologists like ATW should be worried. This is the beginning of the end for viewing Israel as anything more than say N.Korea,

 

DPRK. Dude, LOL. I'm no much of an Israel fan at this point, and really oppose their land grabbing in the west bank, as well as how they're hamstringing relief efforts now, etc.

But 3 reasons that's not a good comparison:
1. Israel will still basically trade with the rest of the planet, come what may. People will come and go from Israel. None of that is true for DPRK.
2. Israel will not fall into a decimated economy anytime soon, or prob within our lifetimes.
3. DPRK, crazy though their leaders may be, impoverished as they are, ain't grabbing land from anybody and daring others to stop them.

The dark, cynical Hamas long game is sadly working. Butcher a bunch of civilians, start a war, sacrifice thousands of your own people, and have the world, in the end, see Israel is a much harsher light (and maybe a more accurate light for their conservative government). All incredibly tragic and sad.

 

You need some history lessons. You are the same type of delusional, anti-semitic left wing extremist as Jeremy Corbyn's brother.

 

Israel isn’t remotely like DPRK - however I think you underestimate the consequences of the actions of Israel. We saw the financial and political damage done to South Africa - and Israel is flirting with the same problem.

 

How reliant is Israel on support from the US and other countries for defense? Can Israel defend itself without external assistance?

 

Because Israel has nukes they don’t face an existential challenge from any of their traditional enemies. Even if the US pulled all
support I don’t think any other country would risk a war to drive them into the sea as the Arab countries tried in 1973.

What my guess is that without US support it would be hard for them to sustain occupation of the West Bank and to build settlements. If Israel was reliant upon their own resources
I think they pull back to more defensible borders probably closer to what the 1967 borders were.

 

If that's correct, we should no longer provide military assistance to Israel. I don't want to be complicit in the killing of civilians, and I also don't want to see Israel unable to defend themselves.

 

You may really be right about that. I like to assume Israel can read a room a little better than 1980's South Africa, but maybe not with Bibi and crew in charge.

 

I’m making an educated guess and am certainly no expert on this but I’m pretty certain that Israel has a WMD edge on any potential enemies.

One thing that WMD doesn’t protect Israel from is terrorist and insurgent attacks. That is why I think the cost of maintaining settlements where they are surrounded by hostile populations is going to be difficult.

 

Supporters of Israel like to put all the blame on Netanyahu. 85% of Israelis are basically content with Netanyah's actions in Gaza except for his financial crimes and worries about the religious parties getting too strong. Otherwise they were quite satisfied with the Apartheid state and treatment of the Palestinians. The very word "Gaza" will resonate for decades like "Warsaw Ghetto". "Rawanda"

Agree with Nook for the most part. The basic point is that Israel will be an international pariah. I suppose the last years of South Africa during Apartheid is a more apt. The current genocide and their hopes for mass ethnic cleansing of the Gazans perhaps to Egypt will lose them a lot their support from the US and other western countries. It is doubtful they can count on replacing this with their dictatorial Arab neighbors as even they have to take into account their populations.

Agreed Israel will do better than N. Korea economically, but is that what say Jews from Brooklyn or Russians immigeantrs would be satisfied with Israel is a small country and Apartheid in Israel is an expensive proposition with several hundred thousand folks just involved in enforcing Apartheid. Without aid from the US and others their economy will go down hill. Already 1 million Israelis live in the US and why would they want to return to a declining economy. There will be an increasing brain drain among the educated and those who have the ability to leave easily.

 

Hamas is finding out...

 

Finish off Hamas. GO IDF!