Don't want to leave you hanging. I am also uncomfortable with forced divestitures of assets on the basis of foreign ownership in the rest of the economy, which undermines principles of fair competition. I don't trust the American companies any more than I do the Chinese ones. If we're relying on "oh, but they'd never do that to their own country!" then we're in some deep trouble. This is my preferred solution. I think legislators went for the easy button instead because we have a lot of domestic tech companies that would fight tooth and nail any attempt to regulate them. By barring the scary Chinese people, they can relieve any pressure to do the real work of protecting Americans.
The Optics are out there though "The Democrats are gonna take your TikTok." - Republicans Rocket River Their is always the tactics that the other side is going to take your Precious
Totally understand the point but I will add that all of our tech companies are banned from China. So if we're arguing fairness, then China hasn't exactly helped its case. Not only did they ban all social media (and Google) but they broke all of the terms of the original agreements that allowed those companies to enter. Google complied with all of the data localization requirements and then the CCP reneged on the terms of their deal and hacked Google in order to spy on the gmail accounts of pro-democracy activists. Then the CCP tried to force the social media companies to disclose identities of Uyghur activists during the protests in Xinjiang in 2009 (again violating the terms of the original agreements with those companies), before banning them entirely. Linkedin was the last social media company and even they were eventually forced out. A basic premise of trade agreements is the principle of equal access to markets. When it comes to social media, we have zero access to their market while at the moment they get unrestricted access to ours.
This is more a Republican bill than a Democrat one. It’s overwhelmingly bipartisan. House vote was 352 to 65, with 50 Democrats and 15 Republicans voting in opposition.
Fairness is important but so is our own value. TikTok is banned in China. They ban whatever they can’t control and anything that gives too much voice to the people. It’s not exactly a model we should strive for.
Trade reciprocity is literally the foundation of trade agreements. All of our trade agreements aim to open up foreign markets for American companies and create equity in a trading relationship. You are simultaneously arguing for some nebulous freedom concept and arguing against free trade at the same time. We shouldn't give away our market access if our companies aren't getting the same access. And I say this as someone who has no love for American social media companies. But if you are seriously arguing that we shouldn't protect market access for our companies, then you're basically arguing that we should privilege foreign companies economic strength over our own which is just bananas.
the vote was yesterday so House Republicans already ignored him This isn’t going anywhere soon, if ever
Companies operating in the US must adhere to US laws, just as they do in China. China mandates that all social media companies be under surveillance and their control. This is a significant reason why US companies cannot operate social media platforms there; they uphold their own values and are not willing to allow government surveillance. TikTok does not have access to the Chinese market either. This is more of a legal and values issue than a trade issue. The US position on this bill isn’t due to fair trade but national security concerns.
Saying TikTok doesn't have access to China is totally disingenous. Tiktok in China is Douyin. Bytedance operates in China and the US with apps in both countries. Meta, Linkedin, and Twitter don't have access to China. Also I dont understand your point. You say that companies in the US must follow US rules. So if Congress changes the rules and bans foreign ownership, then what's the problem? Bytedance then has to follow the rule and divest (or remove TikTok from the US).
I can agree with a lot of that but the PRC is a strategic rival and we are essentially in a low level Cold War with them. It’s also election season and being able to look tough against What is perceived as a foreign threat is very appealing to politicians.
I fully understand the politic behind it. I simply think it's bad legsilation that doesn't solve issues.
I didn't know Douyin is owned by the parent company of TikTok. You have valid points on the trade fairness and uneven access to consumers. But again, the US is not after trade fairness here but national security with this bill. Yes, companies operating here need to follow US rules. As I have said before, US laws should follow US values and of course, our highest laws. We generally value capitalism, free speech and do not value government overreach. Targeting one particular private company reeks of government overreach, anti-capitalism and I think there is a good chance that it will not, at least in its current form, be upheld in Court.
It probably doesn’t and could be found unconstitutional if passed. I’m just pointing out the reasons behind it. There is though a substantive question regarding how and why businesses can be regulated to the point of banning. Whether you agree that TikTok should be banned there are other situations where specific businesses are banned for other reasons.
If you are a national security risk, you can be banned. I think the FCC banned a few hardware communication devices from China because of that. TikTok is a potential national security risk, which is different than being one or very close to being one. My preferred solution is for Congress to require all large social media platforms, among other things, to publicly disclose their algorithm (to see if they are pushing propaganda or dis/misinformation). All social media poses potential national security risks due to their reach and speed.
