February 29th slaughterhouse massacre, IDF shoots starving civillians by the hundreds

Photos like these highlight the cruelty being inflicted on Gaza.

 

No one in the Middle East or elsewhere will take in the Palestinians.

Kuwait actually deported a lot of them 25 years ago, hundreds of thousands in fact and their people and government will tell you the smartest thing they did was deport them and align with the USA.

Egypt has built a border that is substantial and has deported them in large numbers before.

Iraq under Sadam Hussein used the military to push them out.

The Jews pushed them out of Israel when they took over, and didn't give citizenship to those brave few that remained for many years.

The reason no one wants them is complicated.

Part of the reason is religion, the Middle East is Islamic, but not all sects of Islam are equal, and so half the countries off the bat do not want the Palestinians for that very reason. The second part is that because of Israeli apartheid and control, they as a group often times are very poorly educated and have limited skills. In the Middle East, a lot of the more successful nations like Kuwait and Jordan have emphasized education and population size. They do not want to bring in a lot of people that did not get educated in their society and in their government.

Other valid reasons are that some Palestinians are very radical Islamists, and most Middle East nations outside of Iran do not want seditionists in their country. They also know that they will for generations identify and Palestinian. The majority of Arabs in Israel still identify as Palestinian for example.

Another large reason is that countries like Egypt do not want to appear to be supporting the destruction of the Palestinian cause - which is what would happen if they agreed to take in refugees.


At this point we have given Israel the military means to be self sufficient - so they are not going anywhere..... the Palestinians cannot go anywhere, and they are a lightening rod for Iran and Saudi Arabia, whom uses them as a rallying point for the games they play with each other for supremacy in the Middle East.

At this point the USA and her allies have destroyed the buffer zone between the extremists and the Jews - Iraq, so there will be problems. If the USA was going to take over Iraq, and 200,000 people were going to die, they would have been best served to establish a permanent base and to financially help the country be a very close ally to the USA. Instead we invaded when we shouldn't have - we stirred up a hornets nest and left Iraq to Iran.

 

Pretty simplistic viewpoint...that is sadly mostly true. They're dropping like flies though, especially during and since Covid. There are some I don't want to see go.

Pretty much my view and take, from my comfy armchair in the USA, of the entire situation. Reminds me of certain Americans wanting to ship X minority 'back to their country'.

 

So if you read many sources from many eyewitnesses, there apparently are two separate incidents that happened hundreds of meters apart from each other and converged to have people killed.

In the first incident, contractors in the aid trucks got scared as they were swarmed by hundreds and so they took off in trucks and ran over a bunch of people. Once they started driving people were trampled and died as well.

In the second incident, a group of people approached IDF soldiers. They were warned away but did not leave so the IDF shot and killed some of them. This also caused a stampeded that killed more.

These incidents happened within minutes of each other, in the same general area, but maybe half a mile from each other.

Death tolls are different depending on who you ask. Hamas says 100+, IDF says just a few...and independent agencies on the ground gave no estimates.

 

Fake news thread. Hamas propaganda.

 

The only ones who targeted civilians were Hamas (the government of Gaza).

If the Gazans didn't want a war, maybe they shouldn't have started one.

 

By murdering over 1,000 civilians, raping women, abducting hundreds of people. Also, they were not in "a concentration camp".

Stop falling for Islamist propaganda.

There was and is no "genocide", except the one Hamas and other Islamists are trying to conduct against Jews.

You are an intelligent guy, but you are really wrong on this one. I can only assume that it is because of the biased Muslim news sources you consume.

 

I mentioned the conflicting reports. There are two death tolls reported: the total (reported by the IDF as dozens and Hamas Health Ministry as 104), and the one the IDF claims is due to Israeli fire. It's not clear what caused the stampede.

Dozens killed in Gaza aid stampede; IDF says its fire caused no more than 10 casualties | The Times of Israel

Thousands of Palestinians rushed the trucks after they passed an IDF checkpoint in central Gaza, leading to a stampede in which dozens of Palestinians were killed and hundreds wounded, some after being run over by the trucks, according to the probe.

The IDF said that fewer than 10 of the casualties were a result of Israeli fire.

The Hamas health ministry said in addition to at least 104 people killed, around 760 were wounded, describing it as a “massacre.”

Aid groups say it has become nearly impossible to deliver humanitarian assistance in most of Gaza because of the difficulty of coordinating with the Israeli military, ongoing hostilities and the breakdown of public order, with crowds of desperate people overwhelming aid convoys. The UN says a quarter of Gaza’s 2.3 million Palestinians face starvation; around 80% have fled their homes.​

Flour massacre: How Gaza food killings unfolded, and Israel’s story changed | Israel War on Gaza News | Al Jazeera

Witnesses said that the stampede happened as a result of Israeli firing and that the trucks also rolled over wounded people, adding to the death toll. ​

 

It's wrong to say "Gazans" when it was Hamas. This language supports collective punishment. Do you endorse that?

 

We also know from hostages who have returned and from the liberation operation for two of the hostages that they were held captive by "civilians".

 

@AroundTheWorld I take that answer as a yes, you do support collective punishment of all Gazans.

 

In college I dated a woman who's grandfather was a Holocaust survivor. She lived in Israel one summer and went absolutely very pro-Israel even saying she wanted to join the Mossad. I reconnected with her over the pandemic but after Oct. 7th she completely unfriended me. I haven't talked to her since then.

I also briefly dated a woman who had served in the IDF about 20 years ago and was stationed in the West Bank. I completely lost touch with her. When I met her she had moved to the Bay Area and didn't want to go back to Israel.

 

I support Israel eliminating the threat from Gazan terrorists.

If you can convince the Gazan terrorists to not use civilians as human shields and fight openly on the battlefield, then I support the IDF only fighting on that battlefield.

Blame Hamas and those who put them in power.

How do you suggest Israel can eliminate the openly stated threat of repeated attacks like on October 7th - while getting bombarded with rockets from Gaza - and how do you suggest Israel can defend itself, while not being scolded by leftists from the West sitting on their antisemitic high horse?

I am German and (in hindsight) I support the allied forces bombing Germany to rid it from the Nazis.

 

You dated a left-wing lady, which makes sense.

Thanks for sharing.

 

I can actually understand why someone who had family and/or who's life was threatened on Oct. 7th would feel as bloodthirsty as they do. What I find disturbing is the amount of bloodthirstiness and frankly enjoyment that some who have no direct connection seem to get out of watching Gaza getting flattened and civilians dying. I would say the same about those who celebrated Hamas killing, raping and taking hostages on Oct. 7th.

I don't believe war or violence can always be avoided but it shouldn't be celebrated. I made this same point regarding while I do strongly support Ukraine's defense of itself I don't celebrate the deaths of Russian soldiers. It's a tragedy too that most of them are just conscripts being forced into fighting a war.

I'm not sure whether human nature is really good. Humans have been capable of immense cruelty. I also think most humans do just want to live in peace. I suspect most Israelis and Palestinians would be fine with Hamas giving up all of the hostages and the IDF stopping bombing. The problem is there are those on either side who just want to see the other side either completely annhilated or pushed out of the region altogether.