1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[Middle East] US embassy in Israel to be moved from Tel-Aviv to Jerusalem

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Cohete Rojo, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    66,677
    Likes Received:
    44,404
    No it isn't. Ridiculously stupid comparison.
     
  2. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,940
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    People get upset when you continue to antagonize them? I am shocked!!!
     
    Exiled likes this.
  3. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,940
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    How so? It's like when you go to the doctor hitting yourself in the head and you tell him it hurts when you do this.... what do you think your doctor is going to tell your next?
     
    Exiled likes this.
  4. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,061
    Likes Received:
    13,409
    Why is that?

    Maybe after a Manuelito raid on Fort Defiance, "Sigh, those Navajos' anger and violence are so predictable!"
     
  5. Cohete Rojo

    Cohete Rojo Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2009
    Messages:
    10,344
    Likes Received:
    1,203
    Fair point. I happen to think Trump's decision is in the US's best self-interest, and of course I welcome it.

    While the threats are real, there will not be an "intifada" or WWIII. No one - Syria, Egypt, Jordan, or Iran - is capable of helping the Palestinian terrorist groups, at this moment, to fight such a battle.
     
  6. AroundTheWorld

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2000
    Messages:
    66,677
    Likes Received:
    44,404
    Your example is even worse than JuanValdez's.

    You guys act like the constant idiotic outrage by many (not all) Muslims, triggered by cartoons, diplomats moving from one building to another (like that is going to make a difference to the actual life of a Palestinian person, maybe they should be more worried about their government being corrupt), etc. etc. is an inevitability that others should plan for and pussyfoot around.

    The truth is that Muslims around the world need to stop constantly acting like victims and then going into full rage mode, and the world needs to stop constant appeasement mode.

    So much violence, hate and anger on the Muslim side is triggered by the tiniest of things. They - and the leftists arrogantly acting like Muslim rage is an inevitability that should be danced around, as if Muslims were wild animals not capable of original thought - need to stop and self-reflect. People moving from one building to another is going to make zero difference to their lives, unless they choose to become outraged and violent over it.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Commodore

    Commodore Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2007
    Messages:
    30,840
    Likes Received:
    14,338
    Haley sounding presidential...

     
  8. ChrisBosh

    ChrisBosh Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2006
    Messages:
    4,248
    Likes Received:
    252
    This is the first decision I like of Trumps, reality is there is never going to be peace or a solution. Why would Israel ever want it, they are expanding their state without any real threats, the Arab league for the most part is in their pocket (leaders). Israel is after the land they are promised by their Lord and are going to expand further. It's a religious fanaticism that cant be stopped. I say let them have their God promised Land so their Messiah can return. Why bother with such a country, it's insanity but screwing with a country with the fourth most powerful army (plus nuclear weapons) and a hegemonic power on the decline is a recipe for disaster. The world needs to move on, the sooner the better. The Palestinian people should just move out, think of it like Syria, there is no end in sight.
     
  9. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2002
    Messages:
    53,814
    Likes Received:
    53,611
    While I actually agree... Haley is perhaps the best of Trump's cabinet and I expect her to have continued success in politics, who would have been surprised that the U.N. members would be critical of Trump's poorly made decision on Jerusalem. Every significant individual country was critical.
     
  10. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    48,669
    Likes Received:
    17,295
    She does, but her statements don't ally themselves with Trump's statements or actions. Not allying yourself with anything Trump does is a great way to seem presidential.
     
  11. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    63,171
    Likes Received:
    25,826
    Of course they were critical of the first president keeping their word on that promise....but who cares? Doing so was the right thing even if the 3 previous presidents were too cowardly to do so. This is where the Trump Derangement Syndrome really shows up, when you criticize the president even in the few times he does the right thing.
     
  12. Exiled

    Exiled Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,879
    Likes Received:
    1,182
    not sure that would be an end ....what would stop someone like Pat from saying " eh eh ...i saw a dream where the Lord told me the promised land isn't Palestine, it's the whole land between the Nile and Euphrates " blink blinks
     
  13. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    Messages:
    37,714
    Likes Received:
    18,912
    You don't even know what a critical thought is
     
  14. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,940
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    You mean like the taking of land and creating a Jewish state around Jerusalem, a very holy city among the Abrahamic religions? You mean how Israel became an extensive of US Middle East foreign policy?

    I actually don't think you are stupid, you just allow religion to cloud normal cause and effect.

    Like I said earlier..... if you support Western middle east policy of the last 70-80 years then you would support this move.
     
    Amiga likes this.
  15. dmoneybangbang

    Joined:
    May 5, 2012
    Messages:
    20,940
    Likes Received:
    12,824
    LOL.... we have spent over $3 trillion on the war on terror since 9/11.

    You conservatives sure do love spending other people's money....
     
  16. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 1999
    Messages:
    34,061
    Likes Received:
    13,409
    This is not one of those tiny things. This is not about a building. This is about the US dropping all pretext of being a neutral mediator and siding firmly with the Israelis against the Palestinians. The future looks pretty bleak for Palestinians at the moment. They are not acting irrationally; they are in fact recognizing the full import of this change, that they will face more persecution from Israel with no more of the moderating influence from the most powerful country in the world. You want to say they should not take offense and should control themselves and not rage like this was just a slight or an insult. The Israelis are outflanking them in an effort to push them out of their homes and out of their homeland. They are essentially backed into a corner. Violence puts the spotlight on them and their situation. Maybe a sympathetic country in the EU or the Arab World will help if they draw attention to the injustices they suffer. It will be too easy to ignore them if they go down without a whimper.
     
    FranchiseBlade likes this.
  17. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2013
    Messages:
    63,171
    Likes Received:
    25,826
    All it is doing is acknowledging reality. Jerusalem is the capital of Israel, and that's not up for debate. It doesn't do any good pretending that isn't the case. Sure maybe it shatters a delusion held by some of the Palestinian people, but maybe that's a good thing. You don't get a peace agreement when one party is delusional about what they can expect to be part of that agreement.
     
    AroundTheWorld likes this.
  18. Exiled

    Exiled Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2013
    Messages:
    4,879
    Likes Received:
    1,182
    an Israeli perspective:


    [​IMG]
    FILE PHOTO: U.S. President Donald Trump visits the Civil Rights Museum in Jackson, Mississippi, U.S., December 9, 2017 NICHOLAS KAMM / AFP
    Opinion Donald Trump, Visionary of the (Single) State
    Now that he’s ripped the mask off the farce of a two-state solution, perhaps the U.S. president can help establish the first genuine democracy in the Middle East

    Gideon Levy
    09.12.2017 | 23:39
    Theodor Trump, the visionary of the single state. Without Herzl’s beard or Basel, the site of the First Zionist Congress, Donald Trump may become the founder of democracy in Israel-Palestine. Just as his vulgarity and sexism boosted the #MeToo movement, his blatant bias toward Zionism and the occupation might create a backlash that could effect the only remaining conceivable solution. Sometimes you need a defiant bully to shake things up. Trump’s the guy. We should thank this dangerous man: He tore off the disguise and put an end to the masquerade.



    Trump told the world the truth: The United States is not an honest broker, it never was and never will be. It is the greatest collaborator with the Israeli occupation, supporting, arming and funding it. It wants the occupation to continue. It never recoiled from it and of course did nothing to end it. Before Trump, it also mocked the world: the an endless “peace process” that never led (and was not intended to lead) to anything but the perpetuation of the occupation; countless purportedly balanced “peace plans” that America never tried to implement; countless purportedly neutral brokers, a majority of them Zionist Jews; and after all that, the appearance of an impartial peacemaker.

    Kushner's Peace Plan May Not Recover From Trump's Bombshell

    Trump came and put a stop to it. In deciding to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel, and only of Israel, he left no room for doubt: America is with the occupation, with Israel and only with Israel. Of course that’s its right, and the right of its president — most Israelis are surely happy about it — but it won’t bring about peace or relative justice.

    Trump also conducted the sad funeral of the two-state solution, after its long decline into death. Now the heir must be found. In his horrifically one-sided announcement, Trump declared that there aren’t two nations with equal rights in this land of two nations. There is one nation with one capital and all the rights, and another, inferior nation with no rights. That other nation is not deserving of a state if it is not deserving of a capital in Jerusalem. That other nation must now recognize its situation and adjust its goals to the reality declared by Trump.


    The first to do so was Saeb Erekat, the veteran Palestinian negotiator. He said, fine, one state. The Palestinian Authority will have to go with it. It will no longer be able to talk about a two-state solution. It needs to start fighting for the obvious: equal rights for all. One person, one vote. One democratic state for two peoples. That’s the only remaining option other than apartheid. More than 700,000 Jewish settlers, including in East Jerusalem, were already there, and now America is officially behind them. The occupier received another prize, while the occupied received another blow.

    The European Union will also have to adjust to reality and understand that winter is coming. Up to now, the EU has been in America’s shadow, its faithful servant when it comes to Middle East policy. Other than a few insignificant symbolic steps, it hasn’t pursued a policy in keeping with public sentiment in Western Europe, most of which is opposed to the occupation.

    Perhaps Trump’s extremism will shake the EU out of its complacency and spur it to more courageous and, most important, more independent positions. And maybe Europe will also stop invoking the two-state mantra now that a few of its heads of state have recognized that it’s no longer viable. Perhaps Europe will take the lead in a new dialogue about equal rights for all.


    And whom do we have to thank? The president of the United States. When the only genuine democracy in the Middle East is finally established, one day in the distant future, he should be invited. This American ultranationalist, who would have nothing to do with morality or justice or international law or human rights or minorities or Palestinians, should be made an honorary citizen ...."
     
    FranchiseBlade likes this.
  19. pirc1

    pirc1 Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2002
    Messages:
    13,971
    Likes Received:
    1,700
    More like time to expel the Palestinians.
     
  20. durvasa

    durvasa Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2006
    Messages:
    37,910
    Likes Received:
    15,377
    Does Jerusalem include East Jerusalem? If the declared capital is limited only to the part of the city that isn’t considered occupied territory, then I’d say you’re right.
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now