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Breaking: Trump's Wall

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Carl Herrera, Dec 18, 2018.

  1. TheresTheDagger

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    At what rank should we start paying attention to folks? I sure hope for your sake it wasn't E3, because you've had a lot to say on many different policy issues here (including the middle east).

    Unless of course your point in all of this was to say, "ignore me please". A strange but novel debate tactic to be sure.
     
  2. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Obama should have read through the D&D of Clutchfans for policy advice.

    Seriously? You are going to compare posts on a internet forum to a Presidental adminstration citing "experts" to make policy decisions?

    A job where the qualification is a GED doesn't make you a subject matter expert in a macro policy decision. It's a very narrow scope.

    I would consider generals subject matter experts in the AOs they held command in but even then they would only be a single input of other inputs from other subject matter expert such as historians, CIA analysts and political scientists who study the region for a living.

    In the case of the border and questions about the wall, I would consider civil engineers and national security experts as subject matter experts.

    Neither I or the vast majority of of posters claim to be subject matter experts. A border agents is more than welcome to post his or her opinion here.
     
    #1782 fchowd0311, Apr 26, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2019
  3. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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  4. asianballa23

    asianballa23 Member

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  5. No Worries

    No Worries Contributing Member

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    We can say that Trump did not make his Job #1 to root out all of those "criminals, drug dealers, and rapists" from his businesses.
     
    #1785 No Worries, May 3, 2019
    Last edited: May 3, 2019
  6. juicystream

    juicystream Contributing Member

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    Nook likes this.
  7. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Seems to be the common way the hypocrisy of "Need strong borders!" "Hire Americans!" which blames the immigrants but ignores the business that exploits the illegal immigration problem. In most of the articles about trump business that hired undocumented workers there was the sense the hiring people knew that the workers were not legal citizens.

    Some of trump's businesses don't use e-Verify (eg the trump national golf club).

    Report: Trump golf course knowingly employed undocumented immigrants
    https://www.axios.com/trump-organiz...nts-a15ff2d9-6906-4208-aefa-1d284c42a7cf.html
     
    FranchiseBlade likes this.
  8. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    Nook, NewRoxFan and No Worries like this.
  9. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Contributing Member
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    surprised nobody's drawn attention to the editorial in the NYT this week:

    Congress, Give Trump His Border Money
    No, it’s not for building the wall.

    By The Editorial Board

    The editorial board represents the opinions of the board, its editor and the publisher. It is separate from the newsroom and the Op-Ed section.
    May 5, 2019

    President Trump is right: There is a crisis at the southern border. Just not the one he rants about.

    There is no pressing national security threat — no invasion of murderers, drug cartels or terrorists. No matter how often Mr. Trump delivers such warnings, they bear little resemblance to the truth.

    But as record numbers of Central American families flee violence and poverty in their homelands, they are overwhelming United States border systems, fueling a humanitarian crisis of overcrowding, disease and chaos. The Border Patrol is now averaging 1,200 daily arrests, with many migrants arriving exhausted and sick. Last week, a teenage boy from Guatemala died in government custody, the third death of a minor since December. As resources are strained and the system buckles, the misery grows.

    Something needs to be done. Soon. Unfortunately, political gamesmanship once again threatens to hold up desperately needed resources.

    On Wednesday, the White House sent Congress a request for $4.5 billion in emergency funding to help manage the surge. In a letter to lawmakers, the acting director of the White House’s budget office, Russell Vought, sought to convey the scope of the challenge. “In February, U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) encountered more than 76,000 illegal border crossers and inadmissible aliens, and in March that number exceeded 100,000 — the highest monthly level in more than a decade,” Mr. Vought wrote. He described what he said were “alarming numbers” of women and children jammed into Border Patrol stations never intended as long-term shelters.

    Funding for vital services is not expected to last through the fiscal year, Mr. Vought said. Most urgently, the program that deals with unaccompanied minors is expected to run dry next month, requiring resources to be diverted from other programs and leading to a further deterioration in conditions.

    While the request is light on specifics, it does draw some important outlines. Nearly three-quarters of the funds, $3.3 billion, would be earmarked for humanitarian needs, with much of it flowing to the Office of Refugee Resettlement, the agency responsible for unaccompanied minors. None of the money would go toward Mr. Trump’s border wall.

    Several hundred million dollars would, however, go toward shoring up border security operations, including increasing the number of detention beds overseen by Immigration and Customs Enforcement, or ICE. This, for Democrats, is a nonstarter.

    The debate over the permissible size of the detainee population has grown white hot. Democrats contend that the president brought this housing crisis on himself with his push to scoop up as many noncitizens as possible, rather than prioritizing those considered dangerous, as previous administrations did. Instead of asking for more money, Democrats assert, ICE should redirect existing resources to the border.

    Detention beds were a sticking point in this winter’s budget negotiations as well, ultimately resulting in a convoluted compromiseno one seemed to understand. Since then, the issue has festered as the administration has adopted policies that will further swell the detainee population, such as last month’s order for immigration judges to keep more migrants locked up while their asylum claims are processed, rather than allow them to post bail.

    The Democratic chairwoman of the House Appropriations Committee, Nita Lowey of New York, said that the administration was seeking billions of dollars to “double down on cruel and ill-conceived policies” and bail out ICE for locking up more migrant families than it could humanely accommodate. But until better policies are in place, Democrats need to find a way to provide money for adequate shelter.

    Democrats have other, lower-level concerns as well, such as ensuring that the Office of Refugee Resettlement is not used as an enforcement agency or that the contractors and facilities used to care for children meet certain standards. As a condition of handing over additional billions, they are likely to push for at least modest increases in oversight. They should aim to keep such tinkering as narrow and targeted as possible. If the White House is serious about needing the money, it should be prepared to agree to a few conditions — and convey the need for flexibility to Senate Republicans.

    As for the clash over detention beds: Knowing how toxic the matter is, the White House would have been wise to leave it out of a request it needs to advance quickly, postponing that battle for a another day. Both sides need to dial back the fighting words, resist the temptation to finger-point and find a creative way through this minefield.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/05/opinion/trump-border-crisis-funding.html
     
    Nook and B-Bob like this.
  10. asianballa23

    asianballa23 Member

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  11. TheresTheDagger

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    With half a year left to go, border apprehensions set to be largest numbers in last 7 years. Nope, no crisis at the border right dems?

     
  12. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Making Americans less safe to build trumps vanity wall...

     
    FranchiseBlade likes this.
  13. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    All those times trump said his "wall" was being built or had already been built?

     
  14. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    Who to believe... trump, or the U.S. Customs and Boarder Patrol testimony? And... 1.7 miles for $1.57B?

     
  15. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Hire more judges?

    You are confusing illegal border crossers with people voluntarily being apprehended at legal checkpoints.
     
    Nook likes this.
  16. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Trump so far has refused to hire more magistrates/judges.

    I wonder why that would be?
     
    No Worries and fchowd0311 like this.
  17. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Contributing Member

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    Because "hiring more judges" doesn't sound as sexy and jingoist as being "though on illegal immigrants". Doesn't inspire voter turnout.
     
    Nook likes this.
  18. dmoneybangbang

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    Can’t waste a good crisis!!!
     
    Nook and No Worries like this.
  19. TheresTheDagger

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    If ICE is only allowed to hold illegals for so long in holding centers, then they get released only to never show up for Asylum hearings. They melt away into the United States just as those who cross the border illegally do.

    How in the effect of what happens is crossing illegally different from catch and release?
     
  20. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    The majority of asylum seekers do go to their court hearing:

    https://www.politifact.com/punditfa...ty-undocumented-immigrants-show-court-data-s/

    http://immigrationimpact.com/2019/01/30/asylum-seekers-show-up-for-court/
     
    fchowd0311 likes this.

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